What was that Small Creature I Saw in the Garden?

Before answering, you must know that I’m not crazy and I didn’t suffer any head injuries lately.

It was almost dark when I went into my parent’s garden to get some peppers and I saw near the thyme bush a little creature with something like an orange hat on its head. It seemed like a lizard standing on its hind legs (its skin was green). When it saw me, the little creature went into my mother’s flowers and disappeared.

My parents have a huge garden, with many flowers, trees and they even grow their own vegetables. At night, you can hear all sorts of things running trough the bushes and strange sounds. I always blame it on the frogs.

Did I see an unknown creature? Or maybe I just have a mild case of schizophrenia?

Asked by anielle

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  1. Hello Anielle,

    No schizophrenia .. you hear voices more than you hallucinate.

    I think you saw an elemental being. Mind you, there could be lizard people in the world, and other unknown species .. but I tend to think most ‘natural’ beings are elemental. You might know them as fairies or gnomes or names like that. How tall was it?

    Love & Peace
    Ama Nazra (victorian Paranormal Connection)

  2. What you are seeing is a creature that escaped from the astral realm to the physical one. This once rare phenomanon has been happening alot lately. It appeared to you because you are usually in good spirits or atract spirits.

  3. thanks for your answers!

    @Ama: I think the weird creature was about 25-30 cm tall.

  4. That’s odd. Well maybe it was a quick glace or the fact it was getting dark in the garden (plants with bright colors, leaves etc.) that gave the lizard this weird appearance. I’m sorry, but all this, “gnomes, astral realm” stuff isn’t really logical. Don’t get me wrong, I believe in the spirit realm (heaven.) But being a student of the bible to believe in pagan teachings would be against Gods laws. It’s just another way to mislead people from God. Another explanation if you’re going to the extreme would be another species. It’s known that some species evolve to adapt to their environment. But i highly doubt that in this case.

    • The modern day church is filled with so-called “pagan” teachings and traditions. Christmas, Easter, confessionals, statues, sunrise services, and much much more

  5. The astral realm does not go against god. The opposite is true, it heightens belief though it goes against the bible completely. The bible is now corrupt and the only original bibles are long gone.The corrupt bible makes you think god is 1 creature but he/she is not he/she is all of us. You can choose not to believe me its your choice.

    • Joel,
      I happen to think you are right!! You see, even in Catholic teachings, we were taught that The Holy Spirit resides in each one of us. The Holy Spirit is part of The Holy Trinity, being The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. All as one. So, The Holy Spirit is God and God is in all of His creations. He is everywhere. It doesn’t mean that WE are God, it just means that to seek God we only need to look inside ourselves and all around us!

      • Which is also a metaphysical teaching. :-)

        Love & Peace

  6. That I totally agree with you on. After the apostles died, True Christians lost the correct teaching that God accepts. Now Churches produces “Counterfeit Christianity.” They teach from the desires and intentions of their heart. Nowhere does the Bible say we need the celebrate Christmas. Every year you see, Pastors and priest all decked out in the Christmas gear singing holiday jiggles. Disgust me. These are supposed to be the “older men of the congregations.” These should be the ones sherperding and leading the flock on the right course. In fact, Jesus was never born in/around December 25. That got merge with the Romans sun god, Apollo’s celebration. Whatever!!… Doesn’t make the Bible wrong. It clearly states its “beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight (2 Tim. 3: 16).”
    The Bible informs us what worship God accepts. Confessionals?? The bible does mention to go to the old men of the congregation so they can pray over you, that you have committed a sin. Later I can find that scripture for you, if you want. Statues or images worship God does not accept (Exodus 20:4, 5 Isaiah 42:8 Psalms 155:4-8). He detests it. So all you people who have crosses… you’re giving worship to that instead of God. God does likey. Scriptures like Psalms 22:22 & Romans 1:12 encourage a meeting place for worship to praise God in a form that’s clean and is in harmony with his will.

    • Right On! Except I would say something about the crosses. I think that if you have or wear a cross simply for jewelry or sentimental purposes then it is fine, but if you pray to it, look upon it as a “good luck” token or believe that it holds some power or special connection to your Lord then it has become a graven image. Many churches have portraits of “Jesus” on the wall and some people even pray to these images.

      Wow! we are really getting off topic here…. I better shut up :) so we some folks can figure out what this weird creature was.

      Weird creature?

      You mentioned that it appeared lizard like. There are types of Lizards in Texas (probably other places too) that actually get up and walk on their hind legs from time to time. No kidding. The ironic thing (in light of the discussion) is that it is commonly called a “Jesus Lizard” Some of them even have a collar like thing around their neck that flares out when they stand up.

  7. What is your Definition of astral realm, joel?

  8. basicly it is the spiritual realm. it has a few differences.

    1. if spirits learn their lesson they may leave hell.

    2. there are different levels of heaven, the lower the level the more physical it appears.

  9. @CareTaker:I read about those ,yet where I live there are no such lizards.Sometimes,frogs appear in the garden after the rain.
    I don’t know.Maybe it was just a cat or …a mutant frog.I don’t know what to believe.

    Off topic:Maybe this is not important but in my country people used to have a strong belief in the so called “nature spirits”,fairies,goblins,dragons etc.My mother has a book containing the description of strange creatures people claim to have seen,namely in the rural area.Some people believe in fairies even nowadays.

  10. Joel,
    I know we are going far subject. Way off. Don’t know if it’s against the rules to but I like to pick people’s brain. I have a few questions, if you dont mind answering them?
    How is the Bible corrupt?
    How is God “All of us”?
    Hope you understand that isn’t me trying to argue, but see people’s view point.
    oh anyone could chime in?

  11. 1. It was changed over the years to make people easier to manipulate.

    2. we all have a little bit of god in us. I believe in the begging their was 1 god but when he created us he put a little bit of him in each of us till he was no more. Another point I have on this is that we have 2 souls. our ego and our god soul it is possible for them to meet. I know this is true because the archangel Michael told me himself.

  12. Hi Aneille,

    They beleave there are fairies or faey because they are real. I have encountered quite a few on the astral plane. they are realing fun creature to play with and will always lift your spirits

  13. In the astral and in the real world, elementals exist as part of God’s kingdom. Christianity, bless their hearts, didn’t want people following pagan ‘beliefs’ and the elemental world is part of pagan beliefs .. and could not be Christianized … so they became ‘demons’, things to be frightened of. Make them mad, they can be pretty scary. LOL They might seem ‘small’ but in truth, there are some truly powerful beings, known as Devas, but they are also lovely.

    Joel, they don’t ‘escape’ from the astral realm, they live in both .. its us that separate one from the other.

    Social_D, I am also a student of the bible .. but I include the Apocrypha in the knowledge. There is so much more to understand now that we are finding ‘lost books’, and original copies of the ‘books’ that are accepted as part of the bible now (and compare the differences). It was not ‘God’ who said don’t trust the pagans .. it was the Christian ‘fathers’/teachers .. while subsuming important pagan events, such as Yule (sun return) and turning into Christmas (son return), and ‘editing’ out bits they didn’t like, or made them the ‘only’ way to reach God. Sigh. Christianity has a lot to answer for, and I call myself a Christian.

    Love & Peace

    • yes they do but i consider it as escasped because they usualy stay more on the astral than the phsycal. this is probably my last post for a while. I need to think through some of the things I have been thought.

  14. Ama,
    I’m not here to claim i know everything. I don’t. I understand there ” the deep things of God’ that exist in the Bible. Stuff you need to mediate on. Also I agree now there are certain things in the bible that has been reveal, that wasn’t back in the day. But to incorporate other books that has been discover, which i don’t know if it contridicts or goes along which the bible, is dangerous. As revelation 12:9 says” Satan is misleading the World”, and “transforming himself as an angel of light” (2 Corinthians 11:14). We should just becareful what spiritual food we partake.
    By the way, isn’t the Book of Mormon a lost scrolls of the bible or written by a prophet commissioned by God? Even though they may deny it, they only base there teaches on the Book of Mormon. That’s one example i base my opinion on. Not that talking bad about that religion. It just leads us away from the bible.
    God warned us the dangers of pagan worship. 2 Corinthians 6:17 say get away from it, calling it unclean. God is a clean, and wants everything that’s associated with him clean.
    It’s important that any student of the bible take the time to examines one’s self and ask, “if my actions and view point are in harmony and pleases God.”

    • Hi Social_D

      I agree about Satan (by whatever name).

      We have to remember that many of those ‘other books’ were already in the Bible before the church fathers, over the millenia, had them removed. The question then becomes
      ‘which ones go back in?’ And which ones need some serious editing? Oh no, that’s already been done.

      For example, Jesus was a man, only later he became a ‘God’, or the son of God – so do we take John out (my favourite gospel) .. and what do we replace it with? ?? Why do I say this .. one reason .. Jesus was said to be ‘King of the Israelites’ because of his lineage .. from the house of David, the kingly house. But .. Joseph was from the House of David, Mary was not. So how can Jesus be of David’s lineage, if his father was not Joseph, but the Holy Spirit? I love this stuff! So the church then said Mary was Joseph’s second cousin … or something like that .. suddenly they were both descended from David, but this correction has been traced to a source hundreds of years after the Bible was created ..

      And no the Book of Mormon was not an original bible book. It was given to Joseph Smith by an angel called Moroni .. all the angels of God have names that end in EL, btw .. long after the Bible was actually created. He then invented his religion.

      And I check in with God daily. I agree, everyone should. But that is just my opinion. God loves us all anyway .. from my experience. :-)

      Love & Peace

      • 1) Okay say there’s other book that was previously in the Bible, what are the names of the books? Does it go along with the theme of the Bible? In harmony with it?
        2) Some passages in John can be easily misread and interpret wrong at first glance. I must agree. All Trinitarians favorite scripture john 1:1 great example. The term “god” is only a title. Like “King”, “President”, & “Lord”. 2 Corinthians 4:4 talks about a god, but it’s not referring to God our heavenly father, of Jesus. Back in the days there where so many gods, that term was used loosely.
        3) Jesus linage ……..i need to do my research and get back to you.
        4) I don’t know much about the book of Mormon, except from what they preach to me at my door. I was sure to have them explain this to me clear. That the book of Mormon isn’t a lost book that was supposed to be in the Bible. It’s supposed to be addition later to the bible that gives of a clear understand of God and his purpose. Like the example of the Israelite’s experiences and other faith men of old of the Old Testament. The example of the ones in ……..N. America., I think. We could learn and expand upon. If any Mormons in the house, feel free to correct me.

        Hey if there is something I don’t know, I want to know. If I’m wrong about a certain topic, I’ll be the first to acknowledge it. If there is something that’s missing I want to find it. No matter how much God loves us, he requires us to worship him in a certain ways. He has set guide lines for us. Matthew 7: 13-14 gives us the indication that there is right way and a wrong way. Example is the illustrations of the two roads in Matthew. There’s a road that’s wide leading to destruction. These are people who claim to love God but don’t follow his commandants as stated in Matthew 7:21-23. Those won’t be saved. Then the road that’s narrow leading to everlasting life.

        • Hi Social_D,

          1) Have you read the Apocrypha? Here’s a link that explains the situation.


          There were also other books referred to in the bible, that the people of early times would have known, but they might not have been in the original ‘Christian’ bible, eg. the book of Jaspar. One of them ‘the book of Jubilees’ is still canon in the Ethiopian Bible.

          2) Yes, the god of this world is not the God in heaven most Christians believe in. Instead, it goes around sending its ‘evil angels’ to harass people. And I wouldn’t be too sure those ‘old gods’ aren’t still very much present in our modern societies.

          3) I have not read in the bible anywhere that says God said ‘hang around a few thousand years and I’ll give you some more ‘gospels’ to add to MY book’. Yes, people create religions. They might do it for wonderful motives, or they might do it for money. That’s between them and their ‘god’.

          I like the whole of Matthew 7. Good stuff!

          Love & Peace

  15. Demonic

  16. By the way, here is the Wiki definition of an elemental-An elemental is a mythological being first appearing in the alchemical works of Paracelsus in the 16th century.

    Pay very close to the first part of the definition of the word elemental, MYTHILOGICAL, this is a very important part of the definition when you are talking about seeing an actual entity. People throw lots of words around these das as if they are fact, this is a myth.

    • A lot of people believe the stories of Noah, Moses and the Garden of Eden etc are myth and you will find them described as such on many different websites, books, etc. Wiki is not the end all authority on definitions and facts. Just saying…

    • I agree, CareTaker, but its a good place to start. LOL I bounce into there and out through various of their links .. and I love google!


      I’ll be sure to tell the next elemental I talk to that it is a myth. It might describe you the same way .. you see, you are invisible to me, and most people, you don’t use your true name (you might be using your initials, but how can I know that?), I have never heard your voice, nor touched your hand .. which makes the elementals more real to me than you are, because I have SEEN them, had conversations with them – person to person, touched their hands, and shared the experience with other living people who were present at the time. They also saw and touched. So who is now the myth? Hmmm….

      And they have a longer history than you .. even if you are over 100 years old .. elementals have been described by humans since the history began.

      Love & Peace
      Ama :-)

  17. Ama, the only message that I have that you can pass on to the next elemental, spirit guide, kundulani, shaman and whatever else you converse with is “Jesus rebuke you”> I am not attacking you and I will not but if you notice I do not respond to your comments on my posts very often, because Jesus taught me to love everyone and treat them as I would want to be treated. Afterr reading many of your post now and I do mean many, I started to notice that you and I believe very little in common. I do not pretend to know everything but through the leading f the Holy Spirit I and God’s gift of discernment that He so graciously lets me borrow from time to time, I can usually through prayer and study of God”s Word tell if something is Biblical or not. You speak a great deal about the Bible and Christianity deceptively and unbiblically mising in your own spiritis with God message to all of us. So I will not get into a debate nor argument with you about what is Biblical because I think down deep you know what is and isn”t and you have become enchanted with the little extras that somehow came into your life and skewed your Biblical knowledge.

    To Joel: I am not picking on you my friend but those are the oldest and most warn out satanic statements of them all. Almighty God created this world from nothing and even though He lets satan run things on earth right now, He is still ultimately in control of all. If someone tried to change the Bible from what God intended it to be right now, don’t you think that He coulld have stopped those men who corrupted it, Or have you ever thought that God used man to put the Bible in the order and content just as He Himself wanted, come on. When I read and study the Bible and pray for God’s Holy Spirit that lives within me to descern it for me and give me the understandingthat God intends for me, the Bible tells me everything that I need to know about what Christ did for me on the cross and exactly how to live a life that is pleasing to Jesus and how I will spend eternity in Heaven because of it. The rest is just fluff. I have read the Apochrypha, interesting but nothing in there t help me live a mosre Christ like life or to feed and cloth the hungry, just stuff to peak my curiosity and that is what kills the cat every time. All this is not just for me, God did it all for you too. Take an honest open hearted read of the Bible especially the Gospels and the new testament. You will see that Jesus has already taken care of what others seek through guides and mediums and psychics. I am sorry if I offended anyone but Jesus also told us Himself that thise who follow Him would be persecuted for His name sake and like always He was right. If you don’t agree with me it is His message talk to Him if you don’t agree. I am just the messenger.

  18. Hi JK,

    No, quite honestly, I have not noticed you not answering my messages. And you are right, I do know ‘what is’ and ‘what isn’t’ God’s word. As much as I love the New Testament, and am fascinated by the Old, I don’t see it as God’s ‘word’, knowing, as I do, that it was written by men, and changed by men. It’s a historical fact, JK .. it doesn’t disempower God and Jesus for us to accept that reality, and it doesn’t disempower those of us who follow God in our hearts. Yes, there are people like you, who follow blindly, ignore the contradictions, and gloss over things they cannot explain .. but that’s your right. God allows all of us to follow Him, whichever way we do. So .. no problem, you are welcome to your opinion.

    Joel, I think we hit a nerve!

    Love & Peace

    • Right on! I really like the way you put that. By the way Ama, I havent said it enough if at all but thank you for your efforts here. I look forward to reading your comments every day! There are a lot of great people here commenting and sharing. I am so glad I decided to add this new section to the site!

      • Thank you, CareTaker. Yes, you have said it before. :-)

        I agree we are blessed by the people writing on this Q&A section of your site. I especially like the ones I can debate things with, and I don’t mind when they end up deciding they can’t talk to me anymore. LOL It’s happened so many times before. It’s often easier for a person to retreat, than to change their views. And that’s fine. As the saying goes ‘the seeds are planted’ .. doesn’t that make me sound wicked. LOL

        Love & Peace

        • Hi Ama

          You said: “It’s often easier for a person to retreat, than to change their views.”

          or maybe … they ‘retreat’ because they don’t feel the need to argue their case with you??? They see you as a lost cause, as much as you see them as a lost cause – LOL!

          That is what I love most about God – the roads to Him are many. Some smooth and easy to walk, whilst others rocky and treacherous with many pitfalls. But, although one path might be right for one person, it doesn’t make it right for another. So long as we act in a humanitarian manner, then our Faith must ultimately be for the good and therefore pleasing in God’s eyes.

          Its just a shame so many war’s are the result of ‘religious differences’ and intolerance.


          • I believe that all wars are fought over money and power and never religion. Religion is just a tool that is used by those in power to manipulate the people into war.

          • I agree CT – that’s why I put it in quotation marks. But Religion is a darn good excuse for causing trouble for some folk – it kinda justifies it all in their minds some how! Strange things, humans!


          • Hi AJ,

            I never see anyone as a lost cause. That would be appalling. God doesn’t abandon us, regardless of our opinions, I try to follow ‘its’ lead.

            Love & Peace

          • Hi Ama

            I am so sorry – I read your original ‘retreat’ post as ‘tongue in cheek’ and so replied in the same vein (so i thought). Seem’s I didn’t pull it off. No offence meant – I know you’re heart is open in that respect.


          • Hi AJ, no problem. :-) If I am joking, I put a smiley face, or some comment, so its obvious .. otherwise I am usually dead serious! The written word is too easy to be misinterpreted, as we know.

            Love & Peace

          • NO FAIR, AJ!!! You stole my “Roads to God” theory!!!! LMAO!!! I think I coined a phrase somewhat like that on a different post here!! I guess great minds really do think alike! :D

        • Hi Ama

          It was the “LOL’s” that fooled me – hahaha!


          • Hmm… the LOL was about being wicked. Sorry!

            Love & Peace

  19. I agree very well said and that is where my greatest worry comes from. I am not here to pick on mormans or pagans or anyone else but I do try to the best of my knowledge to discern for other who may not be able to, what is Biblical and what is not.

    Caretaker, I understand exactly what you are saying, to many people these days Jesus is no different than a viking or a pokemon character or warcraft character, and that is where the danger in mixing other text beliefs with the Bible can lead people to inacurate conclusions, conclusions with eternal consequences. I say inacurate because I do have God’s Holy Spirit within me to discern discern what is of God and what is not (and it is not exclusive, God loves all and Jesus died for everyone that invites His Holy Spirit in and follows Jesus which is Christianity in its purest form. There is no need for ceremony, intermediaries, priest, preachers, to have a loving and eternal daily one on one relationship with God through Christ Jesus) It is such a simple yet awesome gift, that people today, mostly cynical and wary, just can’t believe that being a born again Christian is that simple. No one human can live perfect life, but Jesus, God come to earth as a human, did live a perfect life, and through His infinate mercy, grace, and love makes His perfection available to us all.

    When many of the people that come to a site like this express that they are in spiritual trouble, offering up advice that includes misleading and inaccurate information about the Bible and God/Jesus, God takes it very seriously. Why do I believe that mormons are in error? Because the Bible says that this is it and if it is added to or taken away from, the penalty is Hell and we know that the Bible is the complete, accurate an inerrant Word of God. You may say, “No that is just what you believe as a Christian”. To that I would say, “No, I am absolutely sure that it is the Truth and the only way that you can know the Truth for sure is to invite the Truth into your heart and soul, give up all the mystereous unknown stuff that you chase after and you too will know that God’sWord is true”.

    I know that what I am saying is not going to get rave reviews from the powers that be here because the mystery in all this is what brings people here. The problem is, and why people that come to a site like this turn a blind eye and deaf ear to and debate vigorously Chritianity is because Christ has demystified the occult, witchcraft, consulting with the dead, and everything of that nature which takes all the fun out of it. I urge you to just stop for a moment and take a look at your eternity.

    Do you think that life and death is just dust to dust or that you have been reincarnated as a door knob, or that you float around in oblivian, or some hoe become and angel in Heaven? Fat chance, and it takes more blind faith to believe in all that jazz than to believe that Jesus is who He says He is. He came to earth to stand in the gap between and awesome and Holy Almighty God whowill not look upon sin, and He bridged that Gap with His own sacrificial blood that is the only thing that can cleanse the sin from us so that we can one day stand in the Presence of our Holy God and Creator.

    • Hi JK,

      I am always curious as to why a true believer (and that is not an insult in my opinion) comes onto a paranormal site, knowing full well the type of response they will get. We are not looking for missionaries. The people who come here are seeking help with paranormal problems, not spiritual ones. Many of them are Christians, and when the church fails them .. as it constantly seems to .. where do they go? I am not saying Jesus Christ fails them, because He never does (in my opinion), but … (and here I am shaking my head) .. in the past week, thanks to the All Experts site, and my name all over this site, I have had 2 or 3 emails a day from people who have gone to the church for help and been turned away .. congregational members or not. The priests and ministers either don’t believe them, tell them they are deluded or insane, or tell them they are not good enough Christians .. but, as I said somewhere else, even priests are beset by ghosts and demons at times.

      One point .. we all have the Holy Spirit within us. I know the Christian church specifies only ‘they/we’ go to heaven, but so does the muslim church, and their foundations are the same. The difference is they believe Jesus was a prophet, which is what the Christians started out believing, before the church ‘fathers’ start deifying him in about 100AD (and it didn’t become official until Council of Chalcedon in 451AD). Check theological history. Jesus reached out to everyone from the cross, if you believe Athanasius (which I do), not just the believers, and we are all God’s children, regardless of our belief system. He created us, and He’s never abandoned us, regardless of us abandoning Him. And I am a true believer in the profound power of the Christ energy to bring change to our world, if we let it. God gave us free will. Yes, we have to choose to follow .. but which church, the one that hides pedophiles? The ones that teach us to hate every other religion in the world because they don’t believe what we believe? The ones that say ‘you must go out and PREACH the WORD, and save the heathens from themselves .. or their ‘false’ Gods? And if they won’t believe .. kill them. According to Christian ‘belief’ that will send them straight to hell. Really nice bunch of people, the Christians.

      While we continue to shut our eyes to the ‘fact’ that change happened to the Bible, and that Christian religion has grown and adapted over the millenia, we are living a lie .. and you know who the Lord of Lies is, just as well as I do. Allowing the possibility of the change happening, at least allows a quieter reality in .. the one that says we are all in trouble now. The foundations of all our faiths, the Catholic Church, is crumbling from within .. and none of the rest of us know the ‘facts’ of just how much really was changed. But we will one day .. even if its after we are dead.

      Until the churches straighten themselves up people will still be seeking help, and not condemnation, anywhere they can. If it takes mingling metaphysical (one of God’s creations) with the Christian .. so be it. I am not the only one who does this. I know a few church ministers who do as well. God bless them. Oh btw, sidelining here, but it does amuse me, I know a number of Catholic nun who are Reiki Masters .. you can’t undo that .. even though the Pope finally got around to banning Reiki not so long ago. LOL Can’t have it in the church, its foundations are in Buddhism and spiritual healing .. but .. didn’t Jesus ‘lay on hands’?

      Wishing everyone a lovely rest of the weekend,
      Love & Peace

      • Hi Ama

        I couldn’t have put that better myself.

        Talking of religions … Father Gabriele Amorth (Chief exorcist at the Vatigan) claimed that “The Devil resides in the Vatican and you can see the consequences. The evil influence of Satan was evident in the highest ranks of the Catholic hierarchy, with cardinals who do not believe in Jesus and bishops who are linked to the demon.” No to mention the pedophilia which, according to the Pope, wasn’t considered ‘so serious’ in the 70′s!!?? (Still trying to work that one out!)

        Sorry …. gone off topic – AGAIN! LOL!


        • Yes, I’ve read that too, AJ, God help us all. When the foundation of the faith is corrupt .. the energy flows through to everyone associated with it. No wonder people are abandoning God .. they think ‘he’s’ part of religion.

          Love & Peace

          • Ama,
            Sweet! I’m so totally stealing that line, sister! (“they think ‘he’s’ a part of religion”) Bwahaha.

            And agreed. I am no longer Christian because my sites were always set on God. Religion hurts a lot more then it helps, in my opinion.
            But this great response is a reminder that God (the source, the CREATOR) has nothing to do with Religion. yay!!!!!


      • Oh Ama!! I have a good Christian friend who practices Reiki, too! She live in India for a year. She went there origionally, on a Mission for the poor!I also love how the church can change things at will, Because they deem something wrong with it!! Also, the church changed it’s mind on many views that were once considered unacceptable! Anyway, I could go on and on! LOL! I have recieved Reiki before and let me tell you, what an experience!!! I could feel the energy as the woman’s hands passed over me, and the change after, was incredible!! And this was performed by a friend of mine who was Catholic!!! Hmmm?! Good point, Ama!!

      • I think there is no doubt that the Catholic Church has been infiltrated by demonic forces at various times over the years, especially during the medievil era. However, the only religion out there now that is calling for the death of non-believers is Muslim, specifically the radical factions of Islam.

        • Hi Erik

          I need to pull you up here …

          Less than 1% of Muslim’s agree with the Taliban. Most are appauled by the radicals within the Islamic brotherhood. So please, do not judge the entire Muslim faith by a handful of evil, sadistic criminals who hide their crimes behind the Qu’an.

          I agree that beheading is still used as punishment in some Arabic states, but that is a punishment of Law. There is a specific place where this would take place – usually in a city square, and after a trial. That is not the same thing as blowing up trains in London or the twin towers etc. And remember, Muslim’s died in those incidents too but the Taliban didn’t care because, to them, those Muslim’s who died were not ‘true Muslim’s’ because they did not agree with the extremists view-point.

          Besides, Christian’s are not better ………. just think about all the troubles over the decades in Northern Ireland between the Catholic’s and the Anglican’s. The list could go on … and on …and ….


          • I agree with AJ’s comment here. There are extremists in all religions .. and groups like the neo-nazis. They are not a true measure of either their religion/group or their Gods.

            Love & Peace

  20. Sorry Jk,
    The Bible is not complete. It has been written and rewritten, edited and parts removed to the point where it’s true meaning is probably lost. Sorry. This fact. Do the research. It had to be translated many times, and in translation, I am sure, much was left up to interpretation. Gospels were removed because some “wise men” deemed them herosy. Or did these Gospels just not go along with that wise man’s plan. Here are some reference for you to ponder, further proving that “you Bible” is not complete:


    And my favorite, (and Ama, I think you will actually like this one, too!) The lost Gospel of St. Thomas!!!


    I could go on and on, but you see, if you choose to do the research, you will find what most of us are saying. In the end it boils down to those who are enlightened and those who choose to remain ignorant.

    • I am not sure about Thomas, Luna.


      Have you read the gospel of Judas .. also ‘interesting’, although I take it with a grain of salt.


      Theology is fascinating.

      Love & Peace

      • Thanks, Ama! I will read the gospel of Judas, and yes, after I read Thomas much further I was unsure myself, so thank you. I read things in it that I was not impressed with. One in particular statement being that a woman must become a man to go to heaven? Sex change? Cross dresser? sorry, being humorous, but in other words, only a man can go to Heaven? Malarky!! So yes, I am sorry I posted it. But, in truth, it only proves my point that the Bible, King James, or any other, is incomplete.

        • Hey Luna,

          You have to read a gospel with an understanding of society in the time period it was written .. so much of the writer’s personality and personal beliefs goes into the message … doesn’t mean its completely wrong, just .. biased ..

          Love & Peace

          • Yes Ama,
            That thought had crossed my mind about the time period. Put, yet again proves my point that man has somehow tainted God’s word. A woman is just as much a creation of God as Man is and God has no desire to exclude one over the other. I think if the Bible needs to be translated/interpreted again, it need to be done by a woman!! LOL! Would be interesting to see how that interpretation would go! Thanks, Ama!

          • LOL! to Luna

            I had a bit of a Bible Study thing going on with my window cleaner this morning (He’s a Jehovah witness). It all started when he asked how I was, to which I replied my mum had died suddenly, which had happened since the last time we met. I then went on to say: “but at least she’s now in a much better place with God, in Heaven”. WRONG! Should NOT have said that! I should’ve known better! Bad me! (Where’s a DOH smiley, when you want one??)

            Anyhow … bless ‘im … he did go to great lengths to explain why JW’s don’t believe that our soul’s go to Heaven after we die … rather we just ‘fall asleep’. We spent 3/4 of an hour outside, on my drive, each armed with Bible in hand, going through quite a few passages about what it means (to him) to die. The neighbours must’ve thought we were mad.

            Still, it was actually a very interesting exercise, not least because my window cleaners Bible say’s things in a much different way from mine. His Bible has been revamped and is in modern english, were as mine is still based on old english (not actually using the Thee, Art and Thou’s, but old style never-the-less.

            So anyway, my point is, if you want to put a different slant on the meaning of the Bible, re-write it using todays language, and use new and specific words to emphasis what the old Bible “talk” means to you.


            PS He also invited me to attend a JW convention held at Milton Keynes this weekend and has also threatened to bring round loads of literature about death next time he does my windows. I’m sure his heart is in the right place, but the JW teachings are really not for me. Still, I’m more than happy to learn more about it … in fact, he has given me some homework already. I look forward to our next Bible session on the driveway – LOL!

          • Ahh…. AJ .. I love JW’s too. They are fascinating to talk to. Also the Mormon’s are good too. I have had a lot of good conversations with people from those groups over the years. Once they gave up trying to convert me .. and I find the JW’s Watchtower a great source of .. inspiration to discuss God from various different interpretations. Sadly, the people giving me magazines here at the house have stopped visiting (JW’s). And I always listened politely .. I just never changed my mind. And yes, our bibles didn’t match.

            Oh well,
            Love & Peace
            PS the last JW I talked to at length told me he was not good enough to be one of the 144,000 saved in the end times. I asked him why he continued to believe in a God that was going to send him to hell? He didn’t have an answer. So much for unconditional love.

          • Oh and Ama, How did they come up with the number 144,000? Just curious as to how that was calculated! Almost seems random.

          • Heaven forbid, Luna. LOL

            Revelation 14:1 says “Then I looked, and there was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion! And with him were one hundred and forty-four thousand who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.”

            My thoughts on this is that was the number of ‘saved’ Jewish people at the time of the writing of the book.

            BTW, totally off this bit of our ‘off topic’. Using gematria, explanation here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gematria the bad guy in the bible is numbered 666. Problem is the number for the ‘devil’ is actually 616. The number for Nero (the Roman leader at the time of the writing) is 666. So, it is speculated in theological circles, that perhaps the writer was not writing the future, so much as making a prophetic religious and political statement about what God was going to do to Nero in ‘those’ end times?

            Much like our newspapers these days .. only more creative? LOL

            Love & Peace

          • Hi Luna

            144,000 divided by the 12 tribes of Israel = 12,000 sealed from each tribe. Revelation 7:3-8

            12 is an auspicious number!


          • Hi Luna,

            I don’t really want to reinterpret the Bible .. I want to take it back to the original sources, and get a really GOOD translation of the Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek! That’s why the Nag Hammadi and Dead Sea scrolls are so important .. from them we can see where the changes were made. I want people to really see, and connect to, the Love that is God, without the patriarchal biases, or the ‘Christian’ ones. While I think some of the new age (for want of a better description) interpretations of the energy world are good, they are not the whole answer. We have to look for it, in combining it all together, and keeping it very simple. Heaven works on the KISS principle, as I have said before.

            Love & Peace

          • It still isnt perfect but I never study the Bible without a Lexicon to look up the words. I am convinced that no one can begin to understand what the Bible says in the first place without looking at the original language and sources.

          • Ama,
            yeah, I hear you!! :) I was being a bit tongue in cheek with that one! ;) Figured that men have been having a go at interpreting the Bible,t hat maybe it was about time a woman tried, just to see what would come of it, but I do agree, if some of the origional scriptures still existed, we would have a much better insight to it’s real meaning.

          • Women do it all the time, these days, Luna. Problem is, some of them are just as radical as the men. (sigh)

            Love & Peace

  21. HI Ama,

    Yea I think we did.

    Hi Jk,

    It was probably stated up there but I was to lazy to read the comments. It is true that lower beings are in control of most at the moment, though less and less of this realm is being controlled, so first off if they have control than wichever `god` you believe in would not have the power to change it. Second, I dont beleave it matters what religion you are in. I believe it matters if you follow it, and if you do you go to `heaven` because if god is as loving as most make him out to be he will let you go.

  22. I can’t help the original poster that much, because I have seen all kinds of things in my life. Some I wold classify as real, others, I would really hope not. I saw images of skeletons hanging in my parents’ house for many years when I was really young. The neatest thing I ever saw was a ninja. For real! I was going to sleep (still very much awake, though), and I saw a ninja creep by in the hallway outside my room. So this could have been a multi-dimensional creature (why not? Lot’s of things are…we are as well). Or it could have been in your mind (Nikola Tesla hallucinated every one of his inentions, so this isn’t a bad thing at all).
    Or….it could have been a ninja lizard. :)

    Just curious, when you say “Pagan”, are you speaking in terms of philosophic polytheism? Or do you mean it to be a general term to describe anything not of the christian god? Legitimate question. I don’t know how deep this debate really goes….but here is my main observation (though I never know how much history to believe in): I don’t know if we will ever truly know how much damage the Roman’s did to Christianity..heck to Judaism. We pretty much know what they did to the gnostics and pagans (really all “heretics”), and it was ugly, mean, hateful, vile and never at all what Jesus supposedly stood for. I used to revel in these debates, and would usually end on “Dead Sea Scroll’s” vs. “Nag Hammadi”. I’ve since become spiritually tired of this, I think. Besides, commenters above have taken on those rebuttals with gusto, so no need for repetition.

    In fact, I wasn’t even going to be a part of this….until I read your words, “reincarnated as a door knob”. I laughed because to me, the statement was lacking insight or knowledge. It may have simply been sarcasm, but you really should know that there were many early christians that believed in reincarnation. Actually, a lot of religions do. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think reincarnation is in the Bible directly anymore, so I wouldn’t expect a devout christian to know that spirits tend to like complete living systems over inanimate objects. There would be little karmic value/return/learning to coming back as a door knob because of karmic debt. Me thinks you would from this life forward, always be a door knob, because you can no longer improve spiritually in ways you were previously able to.

    Before I get too carried away, I’ll just make my point: I understand what you are saying (I really do, as I believed similarly for over two decades.) But you should know that some of us have made other choices in our spiritual walk because we don’t wish to be Christians. Not because we haven’t heard. I thirsted every day of my christian life, and was never fulfilled. So feel free to oversimplify what I believe in. But please be mindful of simplifications. You are correct that people can’t believe “being a born again christian is so simple.” I agree with that sentiment. It’s simple. But in my experience and reason, God is anything but simple. I will continue to seek God for the rest of my life, rather then hold blind expectation to one script that has been open for change, reinterpretation and malevolence for so many eons.

    I just want you to know that some of us know the information you have presented here, and we choose not to believe it. Not because we are spiritual invalids, but because we just don’t agree. Your “truth” still has a sneaking suspicion of sounding like “opinion” to me. That probably won’t change. But much love and peace to you just the same, JK.

    • Whoot! Whoot!!! :D LOL!!! Well said!!!

    • And then there’s me, sitting in the middle, sorting wheat from chaff.

      Lovely comment, Siddle.

      BTW, I got spiritually tired too, and had a long break .. not from my beliefs, but from talking about them on the net. Now I’m back .. and its like ‘deja vu all over again’. Spirituality is a growing experience, in my opinion – while Christianity seems rather static right now.

      Love & Peace
      p.s. doorknob .. to give continuously (good karma), allowing others to make decisions for you (open, close, turn left, turn right)(not so good, perhaps) .. LOL ok, ok, I’ll be good now.

  23. Hello Anielle,
    Sorry, we all went WAY off topic!! LOL!!! The creature you have seen in the garden could be either a lizard or a gnome. Either is possible. And, if you have been reading this lovely long thread, by now, you know you are not crazy!! LOL!!! Either way what you saw is fascinating and nothing to be afraid of or think you are crazy over!! :D

    • also, if you are crazy, then we are all crazy and you have just entered the Loony Assylum!!! LMAO!!! No question is crazy here!!! :D

      • Ha! Ha! Ha!

        In the words of Rowan Atkinson (Black Adder) ….. *WIBBLE!*


  24. AJ,
    If you dont mind, what was your homework that the J.W. gave you?

    • I second that request. I would like to know too.

      Love & Peace

      • Hi Social_D & Ama

        Reading all of John, but paying specific attention to chapters 10 and 14


        • Interesting, Thank you for your reply.

        • John 14 is definitely one of my favourites! And 10 is appropriate too. I am, afterall, a gatekeeper, and I work with the gatekeepers. :-)

          Love & Peace

    • You’re most welcome! And after he’s ‘tested’ me on it, I’ll let you know why ….


      • Side note, and again, totally off topic, but I just purchased your book and am waiting with bated breath for it in the mail!! lol!!! I CAN NOT WAIT TO READ IT!!! I am excited and a bit nervous,(LOL!) but I am sure I won’t be able to put it down!!! :D

  25. Ama, you cannot insult me. Jesus prepared us for the type of twisted thinking and lying signs and wonders. He especially warned us that we would be persecuted for His name sake, I think that particular prophetic word is easily proven here. I don’t mean to insult you but this is the perfect place for a Christian missionary.

    First off, you will never, ever, ever, no matter how hard you try, and no matter how much your heart desires to, be able to seperate Christianity from spiritual things and the paranormal. The Bible is the accurate, complete and timely Word of God and the foremost guide to the spiritual. We are not talkingabout conjured up man made so-called spiritual phenomena, we are talking about reality. It appears that some people here have already made their pact and there is no changing for you. For those people I say, have at it.

    My mission here is not to change the hard core new agers, only the Holy Spirit can do that and onlu if God has not already turned those people over to their on devices. I am here to help those who are spiritually immature and vulnerable and looking for the Truth. I do not want them to wake up one day having that that they were somehow a claravoyant, claraudiant and pure clarabullcrap, and tormented day and night and no matter how much sage they burn and rituals they do it will not stop. Satan and his minions play for keeps, what you may think is just a little fun, a pastime, a lifestyle, or maybe you just don’t know any better, but there is a tremendous price to be paid for all the new age, pagan wiccan fun that a lot of people think they have found when all they have found is another deception and manifestation of the demonic. These so called gift are not from God and they are not free and there comes a time in every medium/psychics life where it is time to pay the piper.

    Your spirit friends are going to call in your debts for all the little tips and tidbits of information that they have given you over the years, They say the jig is up now, if you don;t pay up we will torment you to death and usual what they want if they do not already have it is a contract for your soul which is there ultimate goal or to deceive you until you die. See all that stuff just appeazes the demonic. Christ has the only true power over the demonic, Unless Christ comes soon we will all face death, it is inevitavble. Where or in who do you place your trust, what is your hope for eternity. I will give you another pretty strong reason that I am here.

    You all have done a fantastic job of chasing off most of the Christian brothers and sisters that did come on here and try to help people. I am not that easy. I have been banned and threatened and sanctioned but I am still here and if what I write helps one person understand that God did make a way out, He did make a way to peace and to an awesome eternty in Heaven with Him. I cannot fathom an eternity being totally and eternally seperated from God. The choice is yours, and many of you have already made your choice. We are cautioned very strongly in the Bible whether you believe in it or not that we are not to become a stumbling block for someone else’s faith in God. If you do not believe in Christ that is your choice but be very careful when giving out advice that could mislead or deceive anyone from the Truth of God.

    • Hi JK,

      Nice to see you come out of hiding. Now will you be BRAVE enough to sign in under your real name? It’s very easy to hide behind a pseudonym and say whatever you like, and it protects you, as it does Texture, from being ‘found out’ by your Christian friends who wouldn’t approve of you hanging around with folks like me.

      People come to me for help because they can SEE who I am. My photo, my webpages, and me in the street if they want to meet me in person. They can write to me directly, and don’t have to worry that I will judge them for their beliefs .. I might argue with them about it, debate it, and think its not real .. but if its real for them, makes them a happy, whole, and God-filled person .. whichever God is appropriate, because people from all religions come and see me .. then its all right with me. I don’t react until someone starts trying to thrust their beliefs down my throat … or use the Bible as a weapon. That just turns people away from God, and I am truly trying to draw them back. (Yes, I know you’ll make some smart remark to that one .. but don’t bother .. I think I have heard them all over the years .. and look, I am still here .. not demon inhabited, or harassed, no, instead I am helping people with their paranormal problems … through God, Jesus Christ and the Michael).

      I don’t remember persecuting you? I do remember questioning you about your beliefs. If you take that as persecution .. you might do well to see a counsellor. That’s advice I give to people for lots of reasons, btw, not a criticism.

      And I agree with you on a few things – this is a great place for a Christian person, to give that perspective, without the need to make critical statements about any other ‘person’ .. I think we should all discuss our beliefs. Let’s quote the bible chapter and verse .. I love discussing theology ..

      I never said Christianity needed to be separated from the Spiritual or the paranormal. I agree they can’t be.

      Your belief in the bible is probably a credit to you.. my belief in the fact that it has been changed over the millenia has actually been proved .. but that’s ok. You don’t have to believe it.

      I absolutely agree that ‘Satan’ and his minions play for keeps. I also think that the only solution to the problem is through God, via Christ and his soldiers. I am not mad about the new age industry either, knowing the amount of confusion that exists within it, but I will not tell a person they are condemned to hell just because they don’t believe what I believe .. no, I will quietly talk to them about their beliefs, make sure they have a heart filled with Love and let God lead them where s/he will. And God does lead everyone, JK, they might not be walking the path you are walking, but if their thoughts and actions are from Love, you know God is there.

      Where I don’t agee –

      You have a misson here? Do we need to be converted? The spiritually immature are going to look at people’s Christian criticisms and turn away .. as AJ said so well, in her comment .. Christianity frightens people with its negativity. A God that hates humans and sends evil angels after them? A God that will condemn people to hell? Wake up man! Who actually wants to live with that fear? Why can’t you see the huge conflict between the god of the Old Testament and the God of the New? They even have different names!

      I don’t think the work I do is fun, or a lifestyle, it is a calling. My brother is a mechanic, and he’s been a mechanic since he was born. He started ‘tinkering’ before he was old enough to sit up .. he was always trying to take things apart. Many people are ‘called’ to different jobs in life .. mine is demonology. Yours ..

      And was there a gang of you wanting to comment? I’m sorry they ran away .. I didn’t think I was that scary?? I didn’t notice you being banned, threatened or sanctioned? What did you write? Caretaker obviously has a very open viewpoint on what he thinks abusive talk is, so it must have been pretty awful? Or do you mean on some other sites?

      You know what I love about angels, guys .. that small quiet voice that says .. Ama, play nice! LOL

      The rest of my thoughts I give to God …
      Love & Peace

      • I think you’ve been more than gracious in the face of extreme criticism, Ama. What I like about you is that, you are a very confident and spiritually aware person who is not afraid to share her beliefs. Notice I said “share”. Not thrust, as some like to do around here. Don’t apologize for that. If anyone should apologize it’s the negative Nellies who are so clearly suffering from know-it-all syndrome.

        I see the bible as a tool. Not the be all and end all of the word of God. The bible was written by men….fallible, self centered and often times self righteous men. I think people would take a lot more away from it’s stories if they recognized it as such. However, that is merely my humble opinion on the matter ;) I don’t know everything, nor do I claim to. What I do know, is what I have learned through my own experiences and my own personal relationship with God. Now those lessons…are priceless.

        • Thank you Diana.

          Don’t forget ‘self-serving’ on your list. (sigh)

          And, as you said, the best lessons are those we learn for ourselves.

          Love & Peace

    • That’s a very sad view of the world you have, JK. Especially your implication that God will eventually give up on people. That doesn’t sound like a benevolent, loving God to me. It sounds like a malevolent one. I’d venture to say that you are the one being deceived. Not by God or anyone here, you are being deceived by your own mind. You’ve built yourself up with fear of your creator. Why would you want to live like that? Pointing a finger and judging others who don’t agree with your jaded view of the world around you. We are ALL God’s children. He loves each and every one of us, because we are a part of him. He will never give up on us, and he will never ever turn his back on us in trying times. He doesn’t give preferential treatment to the self righteous nor the arrogant. He doesn’t love any one of us more than the other. We are all the same in his eyes, warts and all.

      You see that picture up there by my name? That picture captures one of God’s children. A woman who is not afraid of her creator. A woman who doesn’t know everything there is to know about the world. A woman who is proud to have a personal relationship with her creator. Are you proud of yours, or are you fearful?

      • Hello again Diana,

        The churches teach people to ‘fear’ God. They also say be ‘awe-inspired’ but they separate the two. I do not fear God, I am awe-inspired, and grateful, and amazed by the wonder of God and all of us, but I have never been frightened by the Light. Got me kicked out of sunday school at nine, for arguing with the teacher. :-( LOL

        Love & Peace

        • What I cannot wrap my head around is how you truly have a relationship with God if you fear him? It’s difficult to love something you’re afraid of… it just seems illogical to me. I feel like the whole “fear God” mentality was created by man in order to keep his peers in control…to motivate them to follow the rules that he deems to be correct. I can’t bring myself to believe that God would smite us for being human and making mistakes. After all, he created humanity. He knows our flaws…because he gave them to us. I believe the mistakes we make are all part of the bigger picture of our lives, they are the guiding force that shapes our souls and our spirituality. So why should we be afraid to learn those lessons?

          I dunno…perhaps I’m misguided. I just don’t see God the way most organized religions like to portray him.

          • Hi Diana,

            I think God not smiting people shows how much s/he loves us. I have a smite list. Just look at some of the actions of people whom you would think God would ‘take out’. Blasphemy is a sin, and yet so many people do it .. me included. And then there are pedophiles and murderers and torturers and warmongers and weapon manufacturers etc etc .. now if they disappeared in a puff of bits, it might inspire people not to act that way ‘since God can ‘see’ all, and ‘know’ all .. ‘ (omnipotent, omnipresent etc).

            And a person can’t have ‘free will’ knowing that someone is going to slap them if they don’t obey the rules all day, every day. No, free will allows us to be truly good, and equally, truly nasty, if we choose to. Yes, we will ‘pay’ in heaven .. the karma wheel can turn long and slowly and we are returned to this planet, which some people believe is ‘hell’ ..

            And just to add a spooky note to my comment .. every murderer I have ever rescued as a lost soul (ghost) has gone to the same ‘healing place’ that ordinary folks, trapped because of sorrow or fear of God’s wrath, has gone too. We are all entitled to the same treatment in heaven. And its not a slap on the hand for being a naughty person .. no, we confront our own wrong doings and must make recompense. And how a person does that is between them and God ..

            Love & Peace

          • I agree wholeheartedly. I find it difficult to believe that anyone is beyond redemption. I know some people have difficulty digesting that, as there is so much evil and hate in the world, and to imagine the perpetrators of the aforementioned being welcomed into the hereafter is unimaginable to most, it’s just the way I feel…deep down in my heart. I think that even darkness can have it’s purpose, it shows us that there is redemption even through chaos.

        • Well somehow my message got cut off.
          I just wanted to comment on the whole “fear God” and” God is Love.” When i was young i would get a lil confusing about that. It didn’t make sense. A person explained it to me this way. When you were a lil kid, and your parents told you, “Don’t do this or that.” As a lil kid your curious, and want to get into every little thing. Before you do anything your parents word return to you, “Do get be playing with that.” At that time any punishment was “time out” maybe a slap on the wrist. So the “fear” of punishment or even letting down your parents would enter your mind. I hope that made sense to be. Because he is the God of love, show his love doesn’t limit from disciplining us when were out of line. For that reason we don’t want to let him down. That why it makes sense

          • Hi SD,

            I agree. When I was very young I knew that God loves me unconditionally, and would never send me to hell. A slap on the wrist I can understand. It makes sense to have someone correct me when I’m acting out. I get told to ‘sit on my hands’, or revise my thoughts – but reaching down and ‘smiting’ us .. I have never heard of that happening ever.

            I wonder how long other Christians think God will wait before he starts punishing people severely for their wrongdoings? Been over 2000 years .. actually longer … if a person believes what some Christians believe, that the world was only created a bit over 4000 years ago, since the old testament seems to have begun around then. Except, of course, Egyptian history is longer than that, among many others.

            Stray thoughts on a very windy morning in OZ,
            Love & Peace

          • Not exactly Social_D.
            You compare God to being a parent; yes He is, but what you fail to see, is that what a parent is trying to do for their child is teach them a lesson. this fear of God concept does not allow anyone to make mistakes or grow and learn. It’s either do or don’t do this or go to Hell. Where is there a lesson learned there? If a parent(now a good and loving one, mind you!) Tried repeatedly to teach their child a lesson that they refused to learn, does that parent just throw their child into a fire pit of suffering just because the will not learn, or do they try to explore other options? That is where my belief in the Karma wheel and reincarnation come in; that is our chance to “get it right next time.” What would be the point in our existence if all God created us for was to zap us into Hell like a big kid with a magnifying glass in the sun, zapping a bunch of ants. The meaning of unconditional love is just that; unconditional. Without condition.

          • Correct me if I’m wrong, there are many examples of faithful men who served God, but committed serious sin. The Israelites, or David to name a few. Time after time, these people were forgiven. True there were some though that was punished harshly by death. Best way to understand it could be comparing it to affection. Say your arm or leg, it affected and spreading. In order to save the whole body you’ll have to cut off the affected body part. Those ones who were punished to our viewpoint harshly, is protection for all of us trying to do things right. Key word is “trying”. We cannot do anything perfect, so it’s not fair for God to require us to be perfect. As long as we try. It’s like that old saying, “ If you fall off the horse, get back on.”
            It’s said we use only about 10 percent of our brain. Meaning we can’t understand things to our fullest potential. So what we see to be unfair, is just in God’s eyes. We can’t read an individual’s heart. God can. He created us. Take a person who built a car from the ground up. He knows everything there is to know about that car. Every noise, movement, or indicator light that pops up, he know what’s up. Same with God. We can’t even try to understand God’s thinking. We are imperfect, how can we.
            The statement you made “If a parent tried repeatedly to teach their child a lesson that they refused to learn, does that parent just throw their child into a fire pit of suffering just because they will not learn, or do they try to explore other options?” Let’s dissected it into 2 parts. The first “a child refused to learn from parents.” The child is basically saying he knows better than their parents, right? That’s what happen with Satan, Adam and Eve. Satan challenged God right to rule. Adam and Eve thought they knew better than God. Didn’t want to listen to God. As a parent you can’t lock your child in the room, or keep them from doing what they want. (Keep in mind we are talking about teenagers to young adult. Little kids as a rule mind their parents) we can try to lock them up, but what good will that do. They learn nothing. Only that in their mind, there right. “ My parents are tyrants!”
            Some kids, no matter how much you love and counsel them, they’re hard-headed. They learn by messing up. Mistakes. Referring back to Satan and the first 2 humans, God didn’t destroy them for that reason. Not only did he have a point to prove to Satan, Adam and Eve. Also all the angels that’s witnessing what’s happening. Adam and Eve grew old and died, when there purpose was to live forever. Therefore, us humans go old and die. As we grow old and die, due to our choices and thinking, we go there trials and tribulations. Soon Satan will be destroyed. Not a doubt in anyone’s mind will the question of Gods way is the only way, will come up again. Second, ‘ exploring other options.” If what you mean by that is, going on a road contradictory of God’s requirements. That what Adam and Eve did. Adam and Eve dies of old age. Nowhere in the bible does it state there in a fiery place of torment. Due to their disobedience, there life wasn’t comfortable. We can only imagine if Adam and Eve did obey God, how much better their lives would be.
            God is such a loving father, giving us sinful human chance over chance to be forgiven. He gave his only begotten son as a ransom for us. If that’s not the greatest example of love, I don’t know what is.
            I’ll tell you something a friend told me. God never leaves us, unfortunately it’s us that leave him.

          • Adam and Eve is a man made myth. Scientifically proven. As for Satan, he turned his back on God, not the other way around; if he were to one day repent, you don’t think God would take him back? As a parent, I would hope that one day my child would see the light and I would be waiting all my life for that, as I am sure God is doing for every one of us.

          • Hello there Luna,
            A lil curious, why do you believe Adam and eve was a myth? What scientific prove is there? Second, what did you meant when you said:
            “As for Satan, he turned his back on God, not the other way around.”
            That’s a true statement, which I thought I implied.
            Whether God will forgive Satan for all that he committed, I don’t know. I don’t think Satan would repent. He had such a long time to do so, he would of done it.

          • Hi SD,

            I have a question. If Adam and Eve are not a myth as the only/first humans on earth, why am I alive today, or you, or anyone? Here’s the logic.

            Think on this: God created first man (adam) and first woman (eve). If we are taking the bible very literally, there is no mention of God creating anyone else at that point, and no one else (but the serpent) was in the Garden of Eden when they are thrown out. They had sex, at least three times, and had Cain, Abel and later Seth .. all male. Where are the girls? Being all males they cannot have children with each other,, and it would have been incest if one of them had been female (a seemingly popular activity spread through the old testament, now seen as a sin) .

            Cain killed Abel. That seems to leave Cain as the only human, apart from his parents, until his brother came later. So where did Cain’s wife come from? And all the other people mentioned from Genesis 4:17? Not surely from Adam and Eve, or you would think it would be mentioned? Or perhaps Jehovah created his ‘Eden’ for his created humans, and other gods created other humans? The mind boggles … all that cross breeding. LOL

            So the story of Adam and Eve is perhaps an allegory, not a fact.

            Love & Peace

          • Or Adam and Eve were not individual people. “Adam” could have been the name for all men and Eve could have been the name for all women.

          • I’m liking that concept too, CT.

            Ummmm … maybe I ought to give Adam & Eve some greater thought. I just assumed it was a simplified way of explaining the beginning of humanity and they weren’t actually real people.

            Off to deliberate …


          • Look up the original definitions of the original words for “Adam” and “Eve” – interesting. I also believe there is a time gap between the first 2 verses of Genesis. Note that in a lot of the creation (such as plants etc) they came forth from seeds that were in the ground! No one seems to pay much attention to that part of the creation story but read it and you’ll see what I mean

          • Man (presumably Adam) was ‘formed (from) the dust of the ground’, and ‘the breath of life’ was breathed into his nostrils. Sounds like the Jewish golem. Only with them you wrote the Jewish Alphabet (I think) backwards on a scroll and placed it inside its head. LOL Or was it a set of instructions on what the creature was supposed to do? Hmm…

            Ok, ok, straying off the OT topic completely here. LOL

            Love & Peace

          • Ahh yes but coincidentally enough we are basically made up of the dust of the Earth. Yeah off topic but maybe that it is a good idea for a new question.

          • Yes, we are .. we have the same DNA as the planet!

            Create away, oh Creator of the TGT site. :-) A new question is usually fun, only I know nothing about the Annunaki, except, of course, what I have read on the net.

            Love & Peace

          • Exactly, CT .. only we are, I think, supposedly reading the Bible as the ‘true’ word of God .. so that means ‘take it literally’ in my opinion??? I guess that makes Cain, Abel and Seth three different groups of people. One lot murders another lot, and a third comes along later? Hmm… the mind wobbles before breakfast. LOL

            Love & Peace

          • Yes and many aspects of what are described when talking about the Annunaki come into my mind

          • LOL!

            I’m liking your train of thought there, Ama.


          • That I can absolutely agree with, 100%. And I thank you for clarifying what you meant, because I really didn’t understand.

          • Argh. I meant my comment from below to be replied to you, however it would appear I didn’t hit the reply button.

          • So just to clarify, I meant that for Social_D. It would appear I’m incapable of replying to anything correctly today. I blame the lack of sleep ;)

          • It does make sense..but at the same time, even if I did fear disappointing my parents, I knew that no matter what I did, they would never abandon me for making mistakes. That’s where the whole thing becomes lost on me.

    • Jk,
      First off, I don’t see anywhere, where Ama could have possibly insulted you; however, I do see you throwing out a lot of name calling and “damning” for other people of religious or spiritual beliefs that don’t exactly fit yours. Is it your job to pass out judgement, or is it God’s? I ask you this, you say psychics and soothsayers will go to hell, but what exactly would you call a prophet? didn’t they do the same things? How about the prophet who predicted the birth of Christ?Was his gift of the demonic? Is he in Hell with the devil for predicting that future? Did the devil have any influence with him? He did the same thing as many psychics; he predicted the future. There were many prophets/psychics of that day predicting the future and passing on the knowledge of God, so why do you not believe it is possible in this day and age? Do you think that God has stopped trying to communicate with us? Do you think he has given up? You see, I haven’t seen you expressing any love for God; just judgement of his creations and seeing the demonic around every corner. You also keep repeating how “The Bible is the complete, accurate and timely word of God; is that because you are trying to convince yourself of that fact? The fact is, it isn’t, including the King James one, that I am sure is what you read. In fact, there are many versions. The only complete and accurate words of God were lost a long time ago and after man had a hand in changing, interpreting, translating and editing them.

      God loves you, JK, but God also loves me, too, as well as Ama, AJ, Diana, Siddle and everyone else here. We are all God’s children. Jesus preached a lot about loving thy neighbors and thy enemies. He wanted us to love one another. Why is that so difficult for you to wrap you mind around. Leave the judging up to God, if that is what He will do. Try opening your heart up to love; I promise, it won’t kill you, damn you or smite you to hell, because loving is a part of God and to love one another as well as ourselves is just a demonstration of much in God’s image we can be.

  26. Hi JK

    “I have been banned and threatened and sanctioned but I am still here …”

    For what JK? For merely expressing your beliefs?

    “You all have done a fantastic job of chasing off most of the Christian brothers and sisters that did come on here and try to help people.”

    Who has chased whom off? OK – I’m no Christian (not in the practising way) but I don’t see Christian beliefs being any less helpful than any other belief, when it comes to helping others spiritually. A Christian purspective helps keep balance on a site like this one.

    But, if those Christian brothers and sisters were here merely with the intentiion of converting everyone to Christianity, then yes, I can see how so many might decide it’s a lost cause on here and moved on to other sites.

    The reason I’m not a Christian (practising) is because Christianity is fundamentally an extremely negative and quite hateful religion, dwelling too much on ‘hell and damnation’ rather than the glory of God; God’s love and wisdom and light. But that’s just me …. I prefer a positive aproach to God, myself.

    That said, Christianity works perfectly fine for others, like yourself, and I am glad it does. Otherwise, what would we have to discuss?


  27. Hi Social_D,

    Stray thoughts on your comment:

    Given a choice I would go for antibiotics for an infection, rather than cutting off the limb. :-) A dramatic gesture is not always the best cure. The threat of hanging (or the needle) for murder doesn’t deter people from that behaviour in America. Nor does the threat of God smiting someone make them toe the line, even among the truly faithful, which is both good and bad. I would prefer not to be smited, but then, I would prefer not to be murdered as well. I have to wonder what God really wants for humanity, if having free will is not the truth? A fascinating subject.

    And then there’s Adam and Eve. I have Genesis open beside me, and reading it I have to wonder at Eve’s intelligence. Why did she choose to follow the serpent and eat the fruit .. must have been a fantastic piece of fruit, or was Eve simply not that bright – or do we define it as ‘innocent’ instead. In that case did God deliberately lead Adam and Eve to the tree by telling them they couldn’t eat the fruit? He didn’t deny them the tree of life, and what would have happened if they had eaten that one first? Is that how a person encourages a child’s good behaviour .. by dangling a gift in front of their noses and banning them from touching it .. or was it a test? Or perhaps it was that God was more innocent in those days too? Have we taught God a lot since then?

    And I have to wonder where people get the interpretation of ‘wilful disobedience’ from. There’s no comment here about Eve nastily choosing the apple knowing she was defying God. More it was Satan being deliberately enticing, and encouraging Eve to break the rules. And Adam .. he could have said no too, but he didn’t? Have to wonder at his intelligence too. Women have been punished for millenia because of what Eve was supposed to have done, but I think Adam needs to accept 50% responsibility for what followed. And God’s punishment seemed very harsh, somehow.

    Fiery place of torment: Mark 9:44, Revelation 21:8, Revelation 9:2 (where there’s smoke, presumably there’s fire) and that smoke brought torments to humanity. Revelation 14:10-11 .. very specific, unless you think that will happen in heaven?

    And I agree with your comment to Diana. God never abandons us, we abandon him/her.

    Love & Peace

  28. Hi,

    I would have to agree with Ama. “Fairies” have a strong connection to the natural world and they seem to appear in our world (for the most part) at dawn and dusk. Several types are known for being short, having odd features (such as greenish skin) and wearing odd clothing. In fact, my best guess would be a gnome. Unless they are causing you problems, I wouldn’t worry about it. Maybe just leave a bit of milk and bread out. ALSO, some “fairies” are said to take on animal form and certain animals are associated with them, frogs being one. So I would say you saw a fairy. NO, you are not crazy, they have been part of people’s beliefs and traditions since the start of man. They’ve been seen by people for just as long, all over the world. I happen to think it’s pretty darn awesome myself. Just don’t acknowledge them directly, they don’t seem to like that. They like their privacy and space.

  29. Luna, every time someone has claimed that the
    bible was false for one reason or another, archaeologists have dug up something to prove the claim wrong. There is no scientific proof that adam and eve were not real. Social D, great analogy, using King David as an example. Two books that I would recommend are Beth Moore’s “A Heart Like His” or Max Lucado’s “Facing Your Giants“, both about David. David made many mistakes….He was an adulterer, a liar, and a murderer. But he truly repented, and had to suffer many punishments for his mistakes, but he was always forgiven. God even called him “a man after His own heart”. He worshipped God like no one else, and because of that He was always forgiven. God is not unfair- He is always just.

    • The theory of evolution proves the Adam and Eve story to be myth. How does the Adam and Eve story fit in with the Neanderthals and the Cro Magnums? Man has been around for a lot longer than the bible states. And where do dinosaurs fit in? We didn’t exist during that time. Science has actually disproven much of the Bible, not the other way around. The only things that were uncovered was possibly Noah’s Ark and there is definate evidence that Christ existed, but I am not disputing that. Adam and Eve was a story created by a primitive man as a way to explain why we exist in the world. You really have to think about the time in which the Bible was written. The Bible is a more of a tool and not something to be taken literally.

  30. Should have read all the way through, sorry about that. Luna, God is a parent. And He will chastise us for our own good. When your child runs out into the street without looking both ways, do you punish him? Or if you catch him playing with fire? We are like small children in God’s eyes. The wisest among us has a pitiful understanding in comparison with God’s. And anyone who says that God is someone to fear, does not know God. When you really begin to understand is when you no longer feel that you have a religion, but a relationship. It should be that intimate an experience, but you can only know Him by spending time in His word and through prayer. I would challenge you to try it. It’s the best thing that ever happened to me. And i once felt the same way about these things as you, by the way.

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