The Fallen Redeemed?

While reading the question “Ghost-Hollywood vs. Reality“, A.J. mentioned an unusual experience, an exorcism where the demonic entity chose to go back to God. Ama also mentioned this. I am glad they can return to God.

Would anyone who has experienced this, please expand on the experience? How often do they choose to do this? Is it an extremely rare event?

Thank you.

Asked by Cherry Taylor

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  1. Hi Cherry Taylor

    Great to see someone is paying attention – LOL!!

    OK – this is how I understand it. Everytime an exorcism rite is performed on a fallen angel (demon), God opens up the ‘gates of Heaven’ to invite them back home. However, it is their choice whether they return to God to be healed, or whether they return to Satan and carry on being naughty little children!

    Fallen angels are a part of God. He created them. However, at the time of the uprising, when Satan was cast out from heaven, one third of the angelic realm were also cast out along with him, for they had taken Satan’s side and therefore needed to be punished.

    Ever since that ‘day’ God has always ‘left the door open’ for any of them to return to Him should they so desire – even Satan himself would be welcomed back.

    Pride gets in the way of Satan’s salvation at the moment, but it is fear that holds the fallen angels to Satan, rather than returning to their Father!! But, during and exorcism, the door is left wide open for them to walk through, without fear, should they choose.

    Thanks for your interest – hope I’ve explained myself ok.


    • Yes, thank you A.J. You explained yourself very well.

      I had never heard the concept of the “fallen being redeemed”. The religion I was raised in, rarely spoke about angels much less the fallen angels. I always had the impression, once they were fallen they didn’t have the choice to return to God.

      (On a side note, A.J. I read your book and it is excellent.)


      • Wow Cherry – thank you so much for your complement (AJ now blushing..)

        Going back to the rest of your comment … unfortunately, religions (not just Christianity, but also the Judaic and Islamic teaching) are guilty of scaremongering – presumably as a form of power, or bullying or control. Putting the ‘fear of God’ into all of us from an early age means, we are more likely to be ‘brain-washed’ into submission and less likely to see God for ourselves and question the religion which is ‘teaching’ us. Burning witches, blowing up people or even saying we will burn in hell for eternity is more about flexing muscles, than it is about teaching Gods true Will.

        Therefore, it is understandable that our subconscious mind automatically ‘trips’ back to that which we were taught at an earlier age. The trick is to try to rationalise the whole concept of Gods true intentions, against the twisted versions man has put in for their own political or empowering ends.

        To me, God is not a vindictive God. Jesus taught us that God was indeed a loving God, not a hateful one (as taught by the Pharisees). Jesus showed us another way to perceive God – initially aimed at both Jews and Gentiles. Shame Christian teaching reverted back to the ‘old’ ways on so many levels.

        This is why I reject Christianity. I do not reject Jesus, but I truly believe if Jesus was here today he would be appalled by the terrible atrocities that have been, and still is, done in his name.

        I’ll procariously crawl back down off my soap-box now …. LOL!


        • Hi AJ,

          I agree. Jesus would be appalled. And then he would be dead, because some fool would kill him to see if he could ‘resurrect’ (or be resurrected) the second time around. (sigh).

          Love & Peace

          • I agree with you, I also believe religions are guilty of scaremongering. I started questioning this, probally when I was a teenager because while I wanted to live a good life and be a good person. I knew I couldn’t live up to what my religion taught. I think most religions teach that they are the “only right way”. In mine I was taught that too. They didn’t believe in musical instruments in the church. I started thinking to myself, what loving God would send someone to hell because they had an organ in the chruch services? I couldn’t understand that.

            As I got older I started to learn that religion was man made and spirituality meant something different. I began to understand I could believe in God and Jesus, and have a relatonship with them. I do miss gathering together with people and I would like to find a church I felt comfortable attending.

            I am happy my son learned at a young age the concept of religion vs spirituality. I believe he has a good relationship with God and Jesus. I’m glad he doesn’t have that awful guilt in the back of his mind that being brought up in a chruch can inflict on a person.

            A.J. and Ama, you both have helped me tremendously on my spiritual journey. I want to thank you both.

          • Hi Cherry

            I am so glad that Ama & I have, in some small way, helped you with your spirtual journey.

            Always look into your heart for the answers. If something doesn’t feel right, then in all likelyhood, it isn’t right for you. (Thats not to say it isn’t right for others – just not right for you.)

            I look forward to many more interesting discussions with you about our spiritual journeys.


          • Hi Cherry,

            You are welcome. We like to help.

            I miss the gatherings too. I don’t know where you are in the world, but you might try Christian Spiritual churches. I found a local one the other day, and this lot might be unusual, but they are trying to blend all the major religions of the world together, to get the best from each. Works for me.

            Love & Peace

    • Hi AJ,

      It’s my understanding that the fallen were not being punished by being ‘sent’ out of heaven. They didn’t want to be there anymore anyway, so leaving was no punishment, and they were given this planet to ‘live’ on (first in the energy, and then manifest for them by God). It was only after Samael (Satan) kept going back into heaven and causing more trouble (there were actually 3 lots of ‘fall’ events) that God closed the doors on heaven to them, unless they chose to turn back towards God and ask to go Home again.

      God doesn’t punish anyone. To punish someone first you have to judge what they do is not suitable to what you believe in, and to make a being conform to what you WANT you punish them. That denies everyone free will. God loves unconditionally, that means we can do what we like. S/he then provided guidelines for us to follow, and ‘guides’ to help us learn and grow. Eventually we might all learn to love unconditionally too .. and then we’ll all return Home and be ‘one’ with the One we are already part of.

      It is our choice, the when and where that happens .. not God’s. There is no fixed date, and there is no ‘time of retribution’. There is only ‘here’ and ‘now’ in heaven’s planes. Only humans try to fix events with dates, because we have a linear existence (from birth to death). I guess that’s why its been nearly 2000 years since Armageddon was supposed to have happened. We keep waiting for it .. but it never shows up .. and I’m grateful, given the descriptions. LOL But, I also know its not real, because an unconditionally loving God would never just select 144,000 (or 288,000 depending on who you read) people as being ‘good enough’ and send the rest of us to hell, from the multibillion people s/he created on this world – the majority of whom are not Christian.

      The door is always open for ALL of us to go Home. We only have to choose.

      Love & Peace

  2. Great answer AJ,

    Hello Cherry,

    How often do demons get redeemed, not often enough yet in my opinion, but often enough to impinge itself into the collective memory of humanity.

    Let me tell you a story.

    I used to run ‘rescue circles’ .. you might call them ghostbusting ones. A group of us would meet each week and help lost souls cross into heaven. We did a lot of good work, with individuals and sometimes really large groups of ghosts. One very unusual day, we helped something else entirely cross over.

    There were ten of us in the circle that night, and three of us ‘saw’ what happened, but didn’t talk to each other afterwards. We were all pretty stunned (all ten of us), and exhausted, by the energy of the experience and we all went straight home. Shortly after I arrived I got a phone call from one lady (M) about another who had been in the group with us (G). Well M said G was shocked and frightened and wasn’t sure she should talk to me about it .. so I rang G and told her what I saw .. and she confirmed every word, as M had done already when she rang.

    This is what we saw:

    Into our circle came a truly beautiful angel .. or it looked like an angel, at least for a moment, and then the energy went totally twisted, dark and nasty, and we realised we had a fallen angel before us, leather wings and all. Once I realised what was happening I told the group to HOLD the energy and not try and talk to the being, normally we would ask it questions to find out what it needed to learn to cross over. So we sat and held the energy waiting to see what the entity would do ..

    In my mind I saw a doorway (gate) open, and before the gate stood probably 30 or more of those creatures making a (two-sided) gauntlet from hell that this demon had to get through, all with weapons drawn, all challenging our fallen to get past them to that Lighted Gate. Well, he went. He fought every one of them as if his ‘life’ depended on it. Every time he was knocked down he got up again, he was cut, battered, smashed, bruised, broken .. but he still fought .. and in the end he was crawling to the gate, and then something miraculous happened ..

    From the Gate came two truly beautiful Michael Guardians, and they took one step through the demons (he was so close to the gate by then) and reached down to him and picked him up. And then they looked at us in the circle, and I said the first thing that came to my mind PRAY FOR GRACE. And my non-religious circle of new age folk prayed to God for grace for all the fallen, and the Michael helped that demon Home .. but he had to walk it himself, Cherry, so they lifted him high enough to still keep his toes on the ground, and he ‘toed’ himself into heaven.

    Then the demons were gone, and the Light of Heaven poured from the Gate for a short while, and then disappeared, and we, very subdued, packed up the circle and went home.

    And three of us ‘saw’ this, and everyone experienced the energy of it.

    And just for the science fiction buffs .. this was before Warf walked the gauntlet during a special Klingon ceremony. I saw that many years later and wondered then if one of the writer’s of the scene hadn’t seen another of the fallen returned to God.

    I shall now write ‘believe it or not’. LOL Remembering the experience still rips my heart and fills my eyes with tears. GOD LOVES EVERYONE. How can anyone doubt that – you can’t doubt that after living through an experience like that.

    Love & Peace

    • Thank you, Ama for sharing your experience. It sent chills up and down my spine.

    • Hey Ama

      A great example – thanks for sharing.

      I always see a large marble stairway raising to the West whenever I send spirit over. Some are happy to go it alone, others require some moral support (such as that demon I mentioned on another thread). So, I took that demon by the hand and walked with it up the stairs to the top. I felt just like mother leading her child to safety. At the top we were met by many angels – they all felt so happy. A brilliant experience.

      We really should not under-estimate the Glory and love of God.


      • Gates (metal archways with doors you can see through and open) .. I always see flower covered gates .. on the same level with us. No ‘ascending’ to God, because God is right here on the same level with us, in us and around us. When I went into heaven with the cancer lady .. we both saw a huge beautiful garden, full of larger than life roses, among other flowers. It had to be ‘my’ idea of heaven, because she was terrified? I don’t know. To me it was just breathtaking. LOL

        Love & Peace

        • Hi Ama

          How lovely … could you smell the flowers?

          Heaven is, exactly how we interprete it to be – as individuals. The only time I’ve ever been past the East Gate, all I saw was pure white shimmering marble everywhere – glistening in the sun. Even the room I was taken to, for the ‘meeting’ was of white marble – even the pillars! The only colour I saw (other than the gold door nobs!!) were various colours of the elementals which surround each of the Archangels .. Oh! And a bit of gold on parts of the Archangels clothing. On that occasion I didn’t ascend a stairway – I travelled across the land on horseback! Interestingly, I saw the outer walls of Heaven quite different. I noticed that the foundations were made of various precious stones. That was quite a sight to behold.

          The stairway leading to the East Gate only ‘arrived’ once I’d started helping others to enter Heaven. But I still see it as shimmering white marble – only, the actual gate is now obscured from my view by, what I can only describe as, cloud-like mist!

          I think I prefer your idea of Heaven ……….. LOL!


          • Oooh! Just had a thought (which is quite scary, in itself -LOL!)

            I think maybe, the reason why you walk into Heaven on the level, whilst I climb, might be because (and I’m sure we’ve discussed this before?) I am ‘air’ whereas I see you more as ‘earth’?? This might explain why I feel the need to ‘ascent’ up into the air to get to Heaven??

            Just a random thought!


          • Hi AJ,

            Horseback is good, though I tend to do ‘dragonback’. Weird sensation.

            I’ve been in the marble hall. It had a huge sun pattern, in black marble, on the floor in the centre .. gorgeous. The walls and columns were all white, as was the rest of the floor. And the whole place was warm and comforting and magical.

            Oh yes, I could definitely smell the flowers, and touch them, and the trees, and there was the sound of birds, and water, and other animals, and it was just wonderful. The lady and I found a bench and we just sat and enjoyed the experience, until a group of angels came towards us, and started talking to her, and then one of them glanced at me and smiled and said ‘scoot’.. and I did. (for benefit of those who don’t know what scoot means, it meant .. you can leave now. LOL)

            Love & Peace

          • Hi Ama

            I believe that the ‘horseback’ part (I was sitting behind Benjamin (my protection guide)- it was his horse) was because I was on a very long and bewildering spiritual journey ahead of me at the time, so to me it was more representative of what I was experiencing and what I was being shown. THat might explain why I have never ‘seen’ that part, since.

            When I meditate, I go to one of two places. I never chose where I’m going, rather let my mind take me to where my subconscious feels I need to be. One is a beautiful enclosed garden, not dissimilar to that which you describe, which feels safe and secure. The other place is a sea shore. I am lying on a beach of soft white sand at the waters edge, looking upwards towards the blue sky. Every so often I feel the warm sea water wrap itself around me, gently lift me up,move me along the beech a little bit, then gently lower me to the sand again. This place seems to have really good healing properties for me. I always feel energised afterwards.

            That said, I’m pretty certain that my meditation garden is not the same place as your Heaven – not unless that is how heaven looks as you approach it from the North Gate?? (Uriel, earth). Hmmm … if thats the case, then that would make the seaside the West Gate (Gabriel, water). Interesting ……….

            Na! I’m just over analysing ………. rewind, AJ ……… lol!


          • alot of people talk about what’s in heaven but what do u do in heaven. I am a adventurous person so i would like to go and do adventurous things.Looking at white walls or big red roses isn,t my cup of tea

          • LOL! Heaven’s what you make it, The Man … so, if you want activity and adventure, it will be given to you with God’s blessing.


          • I agree with AJ, the Man. You’ll find what you want there, when its your time.

            Love & Peace

    • That is just an “incredible” story!!! Thanks for sharing, Ama!!! God really does love ALL of us!!

  3. This is a very interesting question. I really have no relevant story to tell that would add to the conversation but, I did want to state something.

    God loves us unconditionally….he created us after all. It is because of this that I believe NO ONE is beyond redemption. We need only open our hearts and ask that he forgive us of our transgressions so that we may begin to heal. He blessed us with free will, so the decision has to be our own….but he’s always waiting to hear our call.

    • Absolutely, Diana. Couldn’t agree more.


    • Beautifully written, thank you Diana.

      Love & Peace

    • Forgive me Diana, Ama and A.J., but your idea of God loving us unconditionally is based on your own personal feelings and false teachings, for the word of God states that anyone who does not confess Jesus as Lord and does not repent, they will not inherit eternal life! Neither will anyone inherit eternal life who is living according to the sinful nature:

      “Do not be deceived: God annot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.”

      When we come to Christ, we are to walk as he walked. The idea is that, as we go from faith to faith throughout our lives, we are being transformed into his image, displacing our old sinful nature with the new man in Christ, taking on more and more of the nature of God. If we go back into living after that sinful nature, then we are not remaining in him and if we die in that state, then we will not inherit eternal life. Why do you think Paul put so much emphasis on fighting the good fight and running the race to gain the prize? Jesus said that at the last day many would try to enter in, but will not be able to.

      The word of God says, “Unless there is a shedding of blood, then there is no forgiveness for sins.” Jesus is our passover Lamb, our atonement, for he shed his blood in payment on our behalf and therefore, no Jesus, then no salvation! I am amazed at how many people have abandoned the word of God, citing that it is inacurrate and fallable. For those who think like this, their God is not the God of the bible, for his word says that he knows when even one sparrow falls to the ground and that nothing in all creation is hidden from him and all things are open and laid bare before him. So, I’m pretty sure that he is powerful enough to make sure that we have the truth of his word.

      Forgive me for being so adamant about this, but I see many people wandering away from the truth and they don’t even know it! There are people teaching that Paul was a false apostle and liar, that everyone will be saved, that there is no Hell, once saved always saved and now we have those who practice a same-sex life styles who claim to be in Christ, but have no intention of repenting and that becasue they don’t think that God has a problem with what they are doing and that even goes for the so-called pastors, preachers, teachers and evangelist who are living same-sex lifestyles. Don’t get me wrong, they have the God-given freedom to live whatever way they want, but regardless of what they think or say, the consequences are the same as they have always been. Nothing has changed with God in regards to this. Unfortunately, they won’t find out the truth until they take their last breath and then it will be too late. This good fuzzy feeling based on your own beliefs is not going to get anyone into eternal life, but only by entering into a faith covenant with God through his Son Jesus Christ can we enter in.

      “For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. The will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.” (2 Timothy 4:3-4)

      “The Spirit clearly says that in the later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.”

      • Hi Don

        First off, of course you are entitled to your opinion and I’ll not shout you down because of it. Nor will I proclaim you to be wrong just because your understanding of God is different from mine.

        However, your comment; “faulse teaching” ……. by whom to you think I was taught? A ministary? The Mosque? Some tree-hugger hippy types perhaps??? Well actually, none of those. It is God who has taught me, through my Faith in him alone. He has tested my faith to the limits and yet, I still turn to Him. In fact, its the ‘tests’ which makes my faith stronger, not weaker.

        It was actually through a ‘test’ that I started looking to Him for guidance in the first place. Before that test, I had no relationship with God at all. What I have found though, is that God has been nothing but a comfort to me throughout my life – through thick and thin.

        God does talk to me, Don, through his angels – just as He communicated with the prophets. Conversing with Gods messengers is not a ‘dead’ concept. Nor is it isolated to just the privilaged few. It happens to people all over the world, all the time, in varying degrees. How many times to you get a gut instinct about something, only to discover at a later date that you were right to feel that way?

        If you ask God, he will answer you. The answer might not come in a way we first expect, but He always answers us. And yes, some of those answers may come from the Bible but, equally, they can come from the most unexpected sources.

        Do not be afraid to look beyond the scriptures for answers, Don. You might actually be very pleasantly surprised, and also rather humbled, by what you find.


        • I couldn’t agree more A.J. There are far too many instances in my life that prove God’s unconditional love for me to ever believe otherwise. I truly believe God has let me live the lowest points in my life in order to teach me lessons that I could not learn any other way. I think the way we learn those lessons is not in denying how they made us feel but, finding the underlying meanings in those feelings. Do I believe he’s punishing me? Absolutely not. I will never understand fear based religion…I think the only true religion is the spiritual connection we developed with God in our own hearts through our own life experiences.

      • Heck, when did I mock God?

        Good morning Don,

        Actually, my knowledge of our unconditionally loving God is based on my personal Experiences with God and Jesus, not just from a book, any book. Have you ever actually walked with Jesus, Don, and I don’t mean through the Bible, I mean in person, down a grassy hill, towards a river at the bottom, having a long, long talk .. because I have. And no, I am not deluded. I am a visionary, sometimes a prophet .. and right now I am alarmed at the way Christianity seems to be vanishing from the planet – and its all because of the Christians. God is not turning His back on us, but so many people are turning away from Him, because of, as you say, false teachings and false prophets.

        Your message to us raised any number of thoughts – starting with – it’s always been odd to me that the Christians, and I am one, think they have the only RIGHT path to God, and therefore anyone else is WRONG. Next thought – I don’t remember Jesus teaching his JEWISH followers to judge everyone. Personally, I stand by the ‘love one another as I have loved you’. So where did the Christians get it from .. their teachers! Have you ever done any research on the various Bishops in the Catholic (and other) churches since humanity began this journey with Christianity – I have. Great example they were for the modern times – many of them seemed to know all the ‘deadly sins’ personally.

        Your message to us, however, is wonderful! So much more I could comment on, but I will bore the blazes out of the folks who have turned from God and the church because of judgmental Christians and those threats of hell. What a great way to control people, and also very sad, because people cannot remain in a state of fear when God is in their hearts .. no, they become angry with the fearmongers after a while, and in exhaustion and misery, turn away from that which is tormenting them. But its not God doing the tormenting, no, its the Christians – all the different ‘churches’ with their varying belief systems, interpretations of the SAME book, and opinions on what God will do, won’t do, or wants. So, as I said to Ahwatukee just a few days ago .. which church should I follow, which version of the Bible would suit you? I have 13 different copies of the ‘unerring’ Christian Bible – and I mean different. I collect them.

        Back to your message – in studying Paul, during my Theology University course, I never once heard anyone call him a false prophet. Rabid, yes, false no, but how can we truly know .. he lived nearly 2000 years ago, and the Bible has been changed a lot since then – we have proof. And it seems he didn’t hate women anywhere near as much as people said he did. Some of his ‘works’ were only attributed to him, he might not have actually said them. I must admit I didn’t focus on Paul much, I was more interested in the Johns.

        You said “Unless there is a shedding of blood, then there is no forgiveness for sins”. Yes, ‘Paul’ (or the writer) used the old testament to teach the new, but in this case those words have led to the murder of so many people. Blood is the staff of life, the life force of humanity runs in it, and it is a protection, or it should have been .. if you think of Moses and the plague on first born sons it was. The author of Hebrews (the book is only only attributed to Paul, probably not written by him) used it to remind his readers of the covenant between Moses and God – the covenant that was obviously broken, or Christ would not have had to come and save us all.

        I wonder if the Jewish leaders thought about that covenant when they sent Jesus to the cross. I doubt it. They were in too much of a hurry to kill him like a common criminal, because he was stripping them of their authority. But people like Paul liked the intensity of the imagery, and so back it came. Interestingly enough, Jesus shed his blood before being crucified, and on the cross when he was stabbed to see if he was dead yet .. and he wasn’t .. dead bodies don’t bleed blood and fluid.

        Please don’t talk to me about false prophets, or mocking God. Each church should look within its own membership for those who twist the truth to serve their own purposes. At least here on this PARANORMAL site, we are not defying our belief systems, and the teachings of our church , to spread ‘the good word’ among the heathens. No, we come to talk about ghosts, spirits, demons and other entities, and some people look for help with hauntings, because they can’t find it from their church ministers – no, they get told they are deluded, or imagining things, just to start with.

        But in the meantime, thank you for your opinion. We appreciate all opinions around here. We don’t have to agree with them, and I can sound so adamant in mine too.

        Love & Peace

      • This is your truth , Don. It’s what you believe and most certainly you are entitled to that. I stated my truth, and I feel as though I am entitled to that as well.

        I prefer to see God as a benevolent being of love, not one that will punish me with an eternity of hellfire should I make a mistake. I never really understood that part of Christianity….it’s so fear based. That doesn’t make me feel spiritually connected to God at all….and it’s too bitter a pill for me to swallow. I’m not however saying that you’re wrong…because frankly, none of us really knows beyond any reasonable doubt.

        I won’t delve too deeply in my feelings on the bible but, the bible is not the word of God….it’s man’s interpretation of the word of God, as I’m sure we can both agree seeing as God did not pen the bible by his own hand. Therefore, it is fallible, as no man is perfect.

        Here’s the thing about me, Don. I have loads of tolerance and I can respect the beliefs and tenets of many religions, Christianity included. Do I believe everything Christianity is about? Certainly not. I refuse to live a life of fear because some guy on a soap box tells me I’ll go to hell if I don’t. While that might work for you, it doesn’t for me. But, I’m not going to sit here and go tit for tat with you because I am secure in my religious beliefs and no amount of bible passages being spewed at me will change that. I don’t need to bully people into my way of thinking as I really don’t care if you or anyone else thinks I’m going to hell….and for the record, I don’t believe in “hell”.

        So, you can preach on, but, I have to be honest that I’m really not that interested in hearing you tell me how I’m going to hell for not believing the same things that you do…and I’m certainly not interested in you telling me that I’ll go to hell for professing to someone that God is the ultimate example of unconditional love. So, as my GAY BEST FRIEND would say…”you do you, and I’ll do me.”


        • You go, Diana,
          You mentioned the words “gay best friend”….why are you friends with them? Don’t you know God doesn’t love that person? :) Sorry….I couldn’t help myself. God’s supposed view on homosexuality was a major waypoint in my belief restructuring.

          I remember when my family was a part of the Free Methodist Church. We had a homosexual gentlemen attending. He would often stand up and announce his love for God, and yet I don’t really recall what the poor man said, because of all the whispers, snickers and somewhat-silent banter going on about this man…it was overshadowing. You want to talk about judgement? He was baptised before the church. I don’t know if this was by his own volition, but he was often requested to go up to the pulpit and (without any details, least we all melt in our pews), he would recount how many times he had “unclean thoughts” in his week, and then reaffirm that he was trying to change.

          If someone told me I couldn’t love my wife because being straight was a sin, I believe I’d punch that person square in the nose, then go hang out with my wife…..I certainly wouldn’t spend 2 hours with them every Sunday so they could teach me how to repent, then love and desire other men….because that’s just not the preference I was born with for this life (we’ll see if that analogy works….it has failed before when people rebutted with, “yes but God wouldn’t do that….he just hates gay people”…. most folks on here will get my point, luckily).

          I still remember wondering at the time why he was so evil if God had made him. BTW: I was told many times the answer to that. He was simply a sinner….and he had committed to his original sin. My follow up questions were: “why am I not gay, then? Why do I get an easier way out? Is God really that cruel, unjust and unfair?”

          The man was finally kicked out of the church for “not changing his sinful ways” by our pastor. And, Here’s where it gets a little karmic in my opinion. Two months later our pastor was asked to leave because it was discovered that he was having an affair with the gay man (one of the ladies that cleaned the church on weekends found them together in the pastor’s office). The pastor had a wife and three kids……
          (I know you can’t see it right now…but pardon my huge flippin’ grin).

          At this point, I could no longer deny the existence of Karma…more importantly: I hope both men have made peace with who they are, because the people in that church certainly did not. I can’t imagine the magnitude of harm that was done by a strict, yet very fragmented concept of what humans believed God wanted for this soul.

          eh…I laugh….but this reminiscence has actually saddened me quite a bit. :(

          • HI Siddle,

            Instead of expounding on God’s word regarding what you wrote about, I will just supply the Scripture so that you can read God’s stand on it for yourself:

            “I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people–not a all mneaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy andd swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. But now Iam writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolaterr or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. ‘Expel the wicked man from among you.’ ” (1 Cor.5)

            When a person comes to Christ, God requires repentance. What is happening today is that, those who are practicing same-sex, instead of repenting, they are justifying and embracing that lifestyle. Yes, God loves the world, but he requires repentance. If a person comes to him and has no intention of repenting, then this is unacceptable to God. Jesus didn’t shed his blood so that we could wilfully continue in sins of the flesh. Now, just so someone doesn’t get the wrong idea, if a person who is living a same-sex lifestyle comes to him and is in agreement with God in regards to his sin, then he can begin to be transformed into Christ’s image. A person must be in agreement with God that he or she is a sinner and in need of salvation, but God requires repentance, which is a turning away from the acts of the sinful nature, not embracing them.

            We are sinners, even after we come to Christ, but the difference is that the true believer is waring against the flesh, not wilfully engaging in it. So, if a man who is living a same-sex lifestyle is in agreement with God that it is sin and he is fighting to overcome it, then this is the right attitude. The wrong attitude and wrong spirit is the man who is living a same-sex lifestyle, but is not in agreement with God that what he is doing is sin and so instead of repentance, he says, “God loves me as I am and I am going to continue in this lifestyle.” Yet, the word of God says, “Whatever a man sows to, that is what he is going to reap. If he sows to please the flesh he will reap destruction, but if he sows to the spirit, then he will reap eternal life.” God did not make man for man or woman for woman, of this he is quite clear about. If a person thinks that he can remain sowing to the sinful nature and still reap eternal life, he is only deceiving himself, for God is not mocked.

            Now, just so it is clear, those who are sexually immoral have the God-given freedom to live as they want, but understand that the consequences are the same as they have always been. If a gay man or woman wants to live like that, then they can, but not as a Christian, for as I said, when a person comes to God, he requires repentance of them, else you remain in the same fallen state.

          • Hi Siddle, and everyone,

            Original sin was eating an ‘apple’ (fruit), not Adam having a fling with another man – no, he slept with a demon instead (Lilith), before Eve and then he seems to have pretended he was an ‘innocent’ in the ‘garden’ (not noticing Eve was naked until she noticed him? Hmm… Maybe Lilith only ‘looked’ like a woman? :-) And another maybe – were Adam and Eve tossed from the garden, not because of the fruit, but because Adam was a hypocrit, and God finally lost patience? How do we get forgiveness if we will not acknowledge our mistakes and ask for it? Looking at all the hypocracy in the Church (not including Jesus) since that time, I have to wonder.

            God is not a hypocrit. He doesn’t ‘say one thing and do another’ .. he, in my experience, does nothing at all, except allow us to have our free will, but I won’t hark on that. You know my opinion, and we biblical folk can be very long winded .. to the point of people ignoring everything we say, anyway.

            I hope the two men of your story found their peace too, Siddle, and all the people that were hurt along the way. Karma can seem cruel, but only if we are cruel first.

            Love & Peace

          • What ever happened to that great Christian value of tolerance, eh Siddle??

            Your story is funny but sad, all at the same time. I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry either …


          • Don,
            Thanks. While I appreciate you giving me “God’s word”, you only gave me what the Bible says. Before I had a chance to read it for myself, I had your interpretation of it to contaminate the understanding YOU (not the Holy Spirit) had regarding the subject matter. I thought my ego was bad…..I’ve never let it get bigger then God! So, uh…have fun with that….wow!

            I guess it didn’t bother you that so many were hurt by what happened in my church, so you backed it with the reasons why all the folks in my old church were justified in turning their hearts from someone who simply wanted to love God. Yeah, not really surprised by that… fact a reminder. So, thank you Don, for reminding me why I should be so proud of my renouncement of Christianity.

            Sorry to my friends on here who are more followers of Christ’s teachings then me….I mean no malice by this : I’m no longer a Christian. I no longer take “God’s word” from one source. Quote me a million verses from the Bible and that will not change….I will still apply one of David Bohm’s most useful observational postulates: if you fragment truth, then you’ll never see the whole truth. You speak of “God’s truth”, but then take it from one source. I can’t think of anything more discrediting…ha!

            So let’s move from “reasons why you should steer clear of Don if you are a homosexual”. It’s boring me. Let’s just cut straight to acceptance and why you should never call YOUR “truth” the ultimate truth…..

            And allow me to respond in kind, but I will let God speak to you with these sacred scripts, because my interpretation of them would only obfuscate their individual truths…..

            Will you then compel mankind, against their will, to believe? No soul can believe, except by the Will of God. -Qur’an 10.99-100

            Those who praise their own doctrines and disparage the doctrines of others do not solve any problem. — Sutrakritanga 1.1.50

            The Buddha says, “To be attached to a certain view and to look down upon others’ views as inferior–this the wise men call a fetter.”. -Sutta Nipata 798

            Comprehend one philosophical view through comprehensive study of another one.
            - Acarangasutra 5.113

            Truth has many aspects. Infinite truth has infinite expressions. Though the sages speak in divers ways, they express one and the same Truth.
            Ignorant is he who says, “What I say and know is true; others are wrong.” It is because of this attitude of the ignorant that there have been doubts and misunderstandings about God. This attitude it is that causes dispute among men. But all doubts vanish when one gains self-control and attains tranquillity by realizing the heart of Truth. Thereupon dispute, too, is at an end.
            – Hinduism. Srimad Bhagavatam 11.15


          • Absolutely brilliant.

            Love & Peace

          • Absolutely!! I agree!! Siddle!!! Ama isn’t the only one who can dance cires here!!!! :D

  4. Hi Cherry,

    I know that there are those who will and do disagree with me, but I have to contend for the truth of God’s word in all matters, otherwise, if we do not base the truth on the word of God, then we have no foundation for thruth at all. That being said, here is what God’s word has to say regarding the fate of Satan and the fallen angels:

    “Then he will say to hose on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.’ ”

    (In the verse above, notice who the lake of fire was prepared for)

    “And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. The will be tormented day and notght for ever and ever.” (Rev.20:10)

    According to the verse above, Satan and angels will be thrown into the lake of fire (Hell) at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ.

    And in regards to those angels who took for themselves wifes from the daughters of men (Gen.6:1-4; Enoch 7:1-15), both Peter and Jude said the following:

    “For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;” (2 Peter 2:4)

    In the verse above, the word Tartartus is incorrectly translated Hell and is another location within the heart of the earth specifically for those angels who sinned by taking wives for themselves.

    “And the angels who did not keep their position of authority but abandoned their own home–these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgement on the great Day.” (Jude 6)

    When Satan rebelled against God, he got a third of the angels to rebel with him and they will all be cast into the lake of fire at the end of the millennium. God is not offering the opportunity for repentance or forgiveness to Satan and his angels. Anyone who says different is just plainly ignoring Scripture. The love of God does not make obsolete what he has already written, that is, what he has written must take place and that becasue it is his word and that is how we can trust in what he says.

    I would encourage you to read the verses that I have posted for yourself, then you can know the truth of the matter.

    Yours in Christ

    • Hi Don

      Have you ever performed, or been involved with, the Exorcism Rites on a demon? And if so, what were your experiences?


      • Yes, Don, I would also like to know, since I have done them too.

        Love & Peace

    • Don, I respect your right to your beliefs. I know the verses you quoted, I have read them. I am well versed in the “hellfire and brimestone” aspect of the Bible. The church I attended pounded those points home. That is one reason I asked the question. I had not heard of “the fallen being redeemed”.

      I do believe in God and I do believe that Jesus is/was God’s son. I believe God sent Jesus here to earth in human form. I believe God is so much more than we as humans can ever know. I believe man limits what God is by the “rules and regulations” in some churches. I have seen and heard of people that need help from their chruch, but because that help doesn’t fit into a neat little box they are turned away. They are told they are crazy, they’re seeing things etc…

      Don, I have to wonder are you a preacher? If you are and you are reading here, hopefully if a member of your congregation seeks help with the paranormal you won’t tell them they are “crazy or seeing things”. I hope you have an open mind.

      I do not believe Diana, Ama, or A.J. were mocking God. They were not.


      • Thank you for that, Cherry. I have to say that you are right, none of was mocking God….not in the slightest. If anything I think that we are merely trying to explain that there is hope out there, for everyone…not just those who sit in a church pew every Sunday reciting scripture.

        God does not give up on us….I don’t care how many people tell me I’m wrong, or delusional. I know this to be fact. It has been proven to me over and over throughout the course of my life. I see it in the eyes of my children who the Lord so graciously blessed me with, I see it in the love I share with my husband, I see it in the people here on this site who take time from their day to help others with kind advice and words of encouragement…there are so many examples I could go on for days. The proof is all around us, it’s literally everywhere. We need only open our eyes and our hearts and all doubt is erased.

  5. Now with all the fun stuff and misconceptioin out of the way. The question was based on Judeo Christian issues and this is the Judeo Christian answer. There is absolutely no redemption for any kind of spirit or fallen angels. Christ’s sacrifice on the cross is the only way of redemption and forgiveness and His sacrifice was only for humans not sprits or angels. Fallen angels know that there is no way of redemption for them and that is part of why they hate humans. If you go into a haunted house and do find a human sprit if you convince it to cross over it will cross over into hell. No if ands or buts. If you do not choose Christ’s sacrifice as your redemption before you die, you are too late to be redeemed by Christ blood, this is the center of Redemption from sin. The rest is nothing more than wishful speculation.

    • Its nice to know that JK believes that humans have spirits, most true-believers think the human spirit is demonic. That’s a bit of a worry. The rest is his opinion .. or it could be ‘hers’ .. we still are not sure who JK really is.

      I have a question though – if Jesus’ death on the cross wasn’t for human spirits, then why were the old prophets (saints) (Matt 27:53) risen from their graves and seen on the streets of Jerusalem after his death? They had been ‘spirits’ sleeping in the earth, according to the bible .. and there was nothing said about uncorrupted bodies, or decaying ones. And nothing said about them going to hell .. unless you count coming back to this planet as hell?

      JK, I don’t recommend you continue to have conversations with fallen angels. You can’t trust a word they say .. and the only way you could truly know what they believe, or don’t believe, is by asking them. The rest can only be human speculation.

      Love & Peace

      • Hmmm. I have been around Christians all my life and have never heard of any of them who thought the human spirit was demonic or who did not believe that humans have spirits.

        • Hi CT

          I think its all down to interpretation … ah! yes, that old chestnut again! So much can go horribly wrong when we mis-interperate.

          I was chatting to a JW the other day about my mum and, unwittingly said, at least she’s in heaven with God now. To which he replied – Oh! No! She is ‘sleeping’. She will only rise again to go to heaven should God call her name on Judgement Day. So, being me, I asked where was she sleeping and what would happen if God didn’t call her name. He replied that she will remain as dust. In other words, she has no spirit or soul, unless she is resurrected. At least, that is what I thought he meant.

          Either way, I prefer my Heaven theory … at least that’s more of a comfort to me, regards where my mum is now residing, as well as knowing that our actions during life will be accountable for upon death, and not if our names get called at some later date!!


          • I dont know. I was just saying that it may not be as common a belief as that. I have been around a lot of church goers for nearly 50 years and never came across anyone who believed that the spirit of a person was demonic or that we didnt have spirits at all. Im not talking about different interpretations or whether its true or not true. I know a lot of “church folk” and while most of them do believe that a ghost is really a demon and not a deceased person no one I have ever known of holds that the spirit of a person is demonic.

            My first question to anyone who stated that as their belief would be to show me some documentation; I mean where does the Bible say anything like that? I have read it and studied it in depth along with many other books and I missed that somewhere but I do not know it all and so I am open to learn more if you will show me where the notion came from. – That would be what I would say to that person – not what I am asking you :)

          • Thank goodness you’re not asking me, CT …. ‘cos I don’t have a JW Bible to refer you to. LOL!


          • JW Bible?

          • The Jehovah’s Witness’s rewrote the Bible, putting it into ‘modern’ context. I know this because I was reading passages from mine along with the JW, who had his Bible for reference. They are so different, the interpretation and emphasis of certain passages changed quite profoundly. It was a very interesting exercise!


          • And then there was the good Anglican gentleman, whose wife had just died – when I said ‘she’s watching over you from heaven’, he got very upset with me and told me she would only be watching Jesus. I am sure that gave him comfort, but I do hope my family will continue to keep an eye on me after they die. So far they have. :-)

            Love & Peace

        • Hi CT,

          You should visit some of the sects I”ve touched on during the years. Some of their adamant beliefs have been bemusing – including that humans fell and are the demons. But I wasn’t referring to that .. As you said, I was thinking about the VTCM, among many others, who said there are no human spirits, only demonic ones pretending to be ghosts and spirits. I should have worded it better. Sorry.

          Love & Peace

          • Hi Ama

            ‘humans are demons, who fell to earth’

            Is that where the saying, “hell on earth” comes from???


          • �humans are demons, who fell to earth�

            Is that where the saying, �hell on earth� comes from???


            I don’t know, AJ, but it certainly fits. Humans are also ‘fallen’, having been turned out of Eden for defying God, just as ‘S’ was thrown out of heaven for the same reason.

            And if you look at society today – trying to live a ‘good Christian’ life among all this greed, anger and hatred, far more rampant than it was 2000 years ago, is almost impossible – I can understand why others might see it that way?

            Love & Peace

  6. Don is commenting on what has been reveled to him by the Holy Sprit and yes throught the Bible. I would guess that Don does not have a spirit guide either, except for the holy Sprit which is sent to every Chritian that really believes in Christ as Saviour> And like me he does experience the indwelling of the Holy Spirit and the awesome liberation from the law and from our own destruction. We are offendede as I am sure God and the Holy Spirit are when you mix new age malarky with God’s perfect Word and don’t tell me man did it all. God’s Word is just the way God wants it and I think if it were not He could use His awesoneness to make it that way. God uses man as His earthly instrument and that is it instrument. So if you start trying t5o mix strange witchcraft and new age beliefs on a public forum and mislead people on what God’s Holy Word says, we will correct you now and until Christ returns. It does not bother me if you two are talking to each other or another new age person but do not give specualative advice on subjects that you discern by the wrong spirit.

    • Hi JK,

      The Holy Spirit talks to everyone, not just you and Don. It’s very egocentric to assume that you are only ones in contact with that divine being – does this mean you are a minister of the church, trained in Theology? I haven’t seen any sign of that so far.

      That what you believe doesn’t agree with what I believe, only comes down to the different trainings we have had in our lifetimes, it has nothing to do with whether the Holy Spirit talks to you or not.

      You are NOT liberated from the Law. Jesus said he had Not come to abolish the law, just to give us two new ones. (Matt 5:17-18) Heaven and earth have not passed away yet.

      And then you speak for God and the Holy Spirit? I am sure if either of them are offended, they will speak to all of us themselves. Hmm.. no comments over this way, and I feel just fine, no smiting either.

      You are right. God’s word is exactly the way he wants it to be (given that we have free will and the right to find God our own ways), in all the different and varying versions of the Christian Bible available to all the different churches who call themselves Chrsitian. I am still waiting for someone to point out the perfect version of the book. I’ll be happy to use it as my ‘authority on the Word’ when they do. But please, provide proof that all the different copies of various gospels etc that have been discovered over the centuries, with so many alterations and woven in comments, are all fakes .. or better yet, ask God to contact me himself, and point out the version of the bible he’s happiest with. That would be simpler.

      Was the guy from Waco a true believer? Better be careful when you assume that every ‘true believer’ believes what you do.

      And yes, you are welcome to comment on my comments .. which I notice now you don’t .. but don’t pick on the people who come looking for help from ghostly or demonic problems that the churches are refusing to help them with. Unless you have something constructive to add, that doesn’t include the usual bible quotes, watch and learn. Some day you might have to help someone without your bible in hand. And it might be something I said, or AJ, or Diana, or Cherry, or any of the other ‘believers without blinkers’, that actually saves the day. It’s in God’s hands.

      Love & Peace

      • Amen, Sister!

        Ama, had you attended any of the 20 churches I have throughout my life (ALL of them, we left at some point because of bylaws or differences in interpretation), I would have had a COMPLETELY different impression of the Christian God. I’m not saying I’d change anything…..heck, how would I be who I am now unless I had gone through so much pain from loving the heck out of God while being told I was an evil diabolic sinner from folks like J.K. and Don just because I asked lots of questions……because I actually thirsted for God’s love and knowledge….

        For me, the equation was simple. 1) I love God. 2) God created me and loves me more then I can understand. 3) I can’t “know better then God”. I don’t believe I’m smarter then God. So when I came to the realization at age 15, that I had more compassion and love then the God that was explained to me at church, I became fearful. I never wanted to serve a tyrant who had less capacity for love and tolerance–nay, acceptance–then me. Every day of the week I communicated with a God I felt very close to…..except on Wed. nights and Sunday’s when I was told of a God that had extremely human characteristics. If God is human, then we are all very much in trouble.

        • Siddle, you are gorgeous LOL .. do you go bowling on Wednesday and Sunday nights?

          20 churches .. hmm.. I have no idea how many I attended, and still attend, looking for God in the energy, and among the people. A person can find glimpses of ‘him’ in people’s faces, but its interesting that if God is ‘with’ the minister, so many of the congregation don’t like him (the minister) and can’t wait to get rid of him. I saw that a few times too, over the years.

          I’m also a diabolical sinner, given that I talk to dead people and am clairvoyant etc. You are only really allowed to do that from ‘inside’ the church (under different titles) .. and yet I haven’t had one fall down on top of me yet, and my favourite church (the building) was the Catholic Cathedral in Armidale NSW, and Wells Cathedral (not Catholic) in England. I used to wait for the falling bricks, or my feet to start burnings .. but not so far. LOL And I’ve had a couple of my most interesting ‘visions’ inside those buildings.

          I love your equation. It’s what guides me too. I defy, well, not defy, but certainly unsettle my family with my ‘quiet obsession’ with the Bible and visiting churches. They are frightened I’ll turn into a rabid fundamentalist, but after all these years, its unlikely to happen now.

          What puzzles me about fundamentalists is that they say the Bible is the literal (to be taken literally exactly the way it is written) Word of God, and then they ignore the bits they don’t like? Hmm…. and I am not into tyrants either. Why use 20 quotes, when 10 words would have done?

          Ah well, I do, however, believe in free speech.

          Love & Peace

    • Hi JK

      Spirit guides ARE the Holy Spirit. They are sent to us from God. We all have the Holy Spirit with us, watching over us, protecting us, giving us wisdom and helping us with our life choices – whether we want to openly acknowledge them or not. Where do you think your faith in God comes from, if it not from the Holy Spirit?


      • That’s how it is in my experience too, AJ. And we can ignore them if we want to.

        Love & Peace

    • There is a difference in basing your truth upon your beliefs, and basing your beliefs upon your truth. The bible is a testament, correct? Literally speaking a testament is a statement given by a witness of true events, correct? The bible starts with “in the beginning God created Heaven and Earth…. Who can provide a testament to that event? No one, because no one was there. So that alone is a bit deceptive is it not? Deception clearly is not the truth. This is a prime example once again of basing truth upon belief rather than belief upon truth.

      And it all goes back to the irrational way some Christians view the Bible…which is as a holy, sacred or “magic” book rather than something that is simply a book. Fundamentally, what they do is get to the place where the bible says what THEY want it to say…a kind of mirror of their own personal epiphany.

      BTW, how can you even tell if you have the Holy Spirit or not? There are plenty of good people of all faiths and no faith who don’t have your understanding of the Holy Spirit. It just sounds like an easy out to me. So then why do you even bother engaging in dialog with a group of no-good new ageist, agnostics, and backsliders like us? To flaunt your superior knowledge and status before God? To rub in that the rest of us have no hope of ever understanding the Bible, because we don’t have the Holy Spirit? C’mon, guys. At what point do you say to yourself, “Gee, my arguments are getting way out there. I really don’t have an honest answer to the Bible’s inconsistencies. I just believe it, that’s all, I don’t really have a reason beyond that.”

      • Or maybe it is “I don’t really ‘want’ to reason beyond that”? It’s easier to just accept, and not question – safer to be ‘inside’ the box (group, or society), rather on the outside and having to deal with the ‘whole world’.

        But its fascinating out here among the fairies … LOL

        Love & Peace

        • Isn’t it though? I mean, it’s actually quite sad that some people live life in a little bubble…especially when they could be experiencing such wonderful things if they just ventured a bit out of their comfort zone.

          I don’t know, perhaps I have just been taking Don and Jk’s comments a bit too personally. In any case, I do wish that they would engage in dialogue that went beyond telling us that we obviously have no grasp of the bible. They might be surprised about the many things we DO happen to agree on. I think that’s what makes life interesting…not just the surprising similarities we share but the DIFFERENCES. They make life exciting. I mean naturally, we all don’t agree on everything religiously speaking but, so what? Why does that mean we can’t have an open and honest discussion about the nature of redemption? Just because I believe differently doesn’t mean I think someone is a horrible person. Quite the contrary…I find their opinions fascinating if not a bit perplexing.

          Eh, I suppose I just get a little over excited when it comes to hearing other people’s take on spirituality and religion. I just find it utterly fascinating. I can’t help it, its in my nature to question our very existence so of course I’m going to question things that directly relate to this topic. I’m a bit of a child in this way I guess :) Always questioning things and being a bit over eager for answers. It’s just me though, it’s who I am.

          • Hi Diana

            ” …perhaps I have just been taking Don and Jk�s comments a bit too personally.”

            Well, if we were to turn round to them (and those who believe the same as them) stating, CATAGORICALLY, that:

            1. They are absolutely wrong,
            2. They are the faulse prophets,
            3. They are mocking God;
            4. That will go to hell for believing what they say and do;
            5. What they say stands for nothing and that it is only ‘us’ that are right;
            6. It is only us who are working for God and possessed by the Holy Spirit ……..etc

            then, I’m pretty darn sure they would take those comments a bit too personally too.

            Thankfully, Christianity taught one very good thing …. tolorance. I do believe it should work both ways and so, despite our obvious differences, the likes of Don and JK should be – at the very least – tolorent of others beliefs, as much as (I would hope) others are are of them. After all, we can all learn a little something from each other – it just takes an open heart and an open ear (or eye, if you’re reading it – LOL) to expand ones knowledge and understanding.

            That said – I really don’t like it when people assume I’m a New Ager. The really gets my dander up ……


          • I second AJ’s comment. And like you Diana, you will have noticed that I like to question everything, particularly when a contradiction pops up. It’s fascinating.

            I wonder where in the bible it says ‘don’t question anything’?

            Love & Peace

          • Hi Diana,

            First I would like to say in regards to “living life in a bubble,” I do experience life. I love to ride my Honda Goldwing touring bike through different states and see different places. When I go on vacations, I usually go to some tropical island to enjoy the snorkeling and the beauty of the island. I live in the Arizona desert south of Phoenix with about 300 acres of desert wilderness 15 ft from my patio with beautiful views of the Sagaro Cati and all of the desert life. I am also interested in photography and just recently captured my first pictures of lightening. But, regardless of anything that I do in my life, God and his word is at the center of everything. The information that I am sharing with all of you is from 40 years of being in Christ and the study of his word. That being said, all that I am sharing with you is not my own idea, but is what I have read and studied and these things cannot be compromised on and that because it is God’s word and therefore, what God has already said, cannot be changed.

            For example, there is no room for debate in regards to how one is saved and that because this is a faith covenant in blood. This is why I continue to proclaim that without Jesus–the one who shed his blood–there can be no salvation. Also, I don’t believe that anyone here is a horrible person, as I am just sharing the truth because I see people following all kinds of different paths, which are from their own understanding, hearsay or from false teachings and so I am trying to tell you what the truth of salvation is, because there is only one way and that is through the One who shed his blood for you.

            Therefore, when I read all of these beliefs that are foreign to God’s word, then I contend for the truth. This started out because I read that people are believing in human spirits wandering around after death, yet, the word of God makes it clear that he knows the exact time of each persons death, whether saved or unsaved and there angels waiting to take each person who dies to their respective places. To say that a human being has to assist God in helping people passover to the other side would be to claim that God doesn’t know what is going on, yet, his word says that nothing in all creation is hidden from him and everything is laid bare before him. This means that he is aware of every little thing that is going on from the depths of the ocean to what takes place in heaven, as well as everything that is taking place on the earth. In fact, his word states that he searches the hearts and the minds of all people.

            I have been trying to get the point across that, the spiritual activity that is encountered by human beings is not caused by human spirits, but by those fallen angels, also called demons and familiar spirits. They are familiar spirits because they know people and events and they replay those events and masqarade as human apparitions. Why do they do this? To keep people believing that human spirits are the cause of the paranormal activity. But for what purpose? Because, once a person, no matter who it is, attempts to contact a spirit, they become a medium or spiritist, which is forbidden by God. This activity keeps a person in the sinful nature and therefore, separates them from God. The other problem with this is that by being open to communicate with these spirits, even out of ignorance, this opens up the ablity for demonic interaction with the individual for demonic activity, oppression and or possession. These demonic beings will come to channelers or mediums as “spirit guides” or present themselves as a human spirits, like a deceased family member. They reenact murders, rap on walls, make scratching noises, levitate and hurl objects, etc. In most cases, they are not going to reveal you who they are!

            The interest in paranormal activity continues to increase with more and more people becoming mediums and ghost hunters, which is exactly what Satan and his angels want and that because it keeps people in sin and gives them opportunity to interact with human beings for oppression and or possession. Also, just because nothing threatening has yet to happen doesn’t mean that it can’t and won’t. Once a person has opened that door, they are vulnerable to spiritual attack. There is a reason as to why there is a spike in the interest in paranormal activity and that because it is going to aid Satan and his angels in the events of the last days.

            If people want spiritaul activity, they will have more they bagained for during that last days. A the blowing of the 5th trumpet judgment, an angel will open the Abyss and out of it will come demonic beings who will have the appearance of locusts amored for battle and wil also have stings like scorpions. These will be commanded to torment the inhabitants of the earth by those stings for 5 months and no one will be able die during that time, for the word of God says that, men will try to kill themselves but death will flee away. After that, the 6th trumpet will be blown and four evil angels along with an army of 200 million demonic beings will be released for the purpose of killing a third of what is left of the inhabitants of the earth. Those times will be a time of ultimate terror, because what people have so eagerly sought after in seances, tarot card reading, channeling, and so forth, will at that time be out in the open and life threatening!

            The 5th and 6th trupets are two of three woes, woes because they are all demonic in nature. If that wasn’t enough, the 7th trumpet/third woe will be the ultimate in that, this is when Satan and his angels will be thrown out of heaven by Michael and his angels and they will be restricted to the earth for that last 3 1/2 years before the Lord returns where they will reek the ultimate evil upon mankind, especially the great tribulation saints.

            Every person who comes into the world, once he comes to an age of accountablity, is on his way to the lake of fire, also called Hell and the second death. A person doesn’t have do anything to get on that road and that because they are already on it. God in his mercy provided a way for us to get off of that road by sending his Son to live a perfect life on our behalf in order to make payment for sin and to make a way for us to escape God’s wrath and his condemning judgment. If we have faith in Jesus, then we are covered by his shed blood and are reconciled to God, that is, we are brought back into a right relationship with him because the wrath that we deserve was put on Jesus and so the payment has been satisfied. The information that I have been sharing with you here is the truth. What will you do with Jesus?

          • I hadn’t thought of it from that perspective, and you know what? You’re right…that is offensive….and for lack of a better word…mean. I just wish that they could realize that the bullying is accomplishing exactly the opposite of what they want. It’s not leading anyone towards’s more likely pushing them away. This is why I really have a problem with organized religion.because at the end of the day it ends up having nothing to do with God, and everything to do with ego. People develop that “I’m better than you” mentality and everything that’s important ends up being left by the wayside.

          • Hello all,

            I have read some of the posts and I wanted to clarify something, first, I am not forcing anyone to do anything that they don’t want to. All I am doing is presenting the truth. My example is that, A.J. had made the claim that she did not need Jesus to in order to be saved and I presented Scripture to the contrary and that because, as I mentioned, without the Son of God, no one has access to God the Father. I have merely been contending for the truth when I see a false teaching. I have forced nothing upon anyone, but have only presented the truth based on the God’s word. If anyone does not consider the bible to be God’s word, then I can show you all the Scripture you want and it won’t make any difference.

            If your house was on fire, wouldn’t you want me to tell you about it? Well, when I see people ignoring the truth of God’s word and trusting in their own beliefs, or the false teachings of others, then I want to tell the truth about it and that is, you can’t get there like that! Salvation is given by God and he is the One who makes the rules. He is the One who is going to judge and therefore, we have to do it his way. I am not speaking about anything on my own behalf, but what is in his word. Someone says, “I don’t need Jesus to be saved” and I present Scripture that shows you do need him. How is that being mean? I’d rather tell you the truth, then have someone say, “I wish he had said something to me.”

            God has made it clear that there is eternal separation from him or eternal life with him and there is no middle ground. It is a miracle that he provided salvation at all, because we are worthy of death, because sin entered into the world through one man and so all sinned. The wages of sin is death! In the same way that sin entered the world through one man, so also eternal life came through one man, Jesus Christ. By the way, in regards to religion, I don’t belong to any. I am not one for religion, but for a personal relationship with God through his Son. I’m not preaching to anyone to join any churches or denominations, but only Christ crucified.

            So, forgive me if I have offended anyone, as this was is not my intention, but only to proclaim the truth. Even Jesus doesn’t force anyone to believe in him for he says, “I stand at the door and knock.” Salvation is not something to force upon anyone, but it should be viewed as a great blessing and that because the person who believes is escaping wrath and judgment and gaining eternal life. But again, it must be done according to God’s will and that is through his Son. After all, he is the One who died for us and the one who intercedes for us after we say “Yes” to him.

  7. Don I agree with you as well that there are many false gospels out there, even now. It is amazing how blatantly people are taking the Bible, God Breated instruction and just making their own personal gospel out of it. But brother, is it just another stern warning given to us His Word that these thing would take place. It is amazing how all true believers guided by the same sprit all discern the major point of Christianity and the Bible the same way, yet we are seeing this sharp rise in this new age personal interpretation of the Bible and the Gospel that in most cases are nothing short of blasphemy. God did give us all free will, but absolutely no one has any freedom to interpret the Bible withut having the discerment of the Holy Spirit. Without the interpretation of the Holy Spirit it is just a personal summary of a bunch of stories. We have to remember that sometimes when we are discussing the Word with unbelievers. We have a few folks that post vociforously so we do have a duty to make sure that what God meant in His Word is not diluted or misconceived in any way. You cannot believe parts of the Bible and disbelieve the rest is a sin against the very nature of God and the worst of deception.